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Thread: Type 9 gearbox tutorial

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    Type 9 gearbox tutorial

    I'm writing this tutorial mainly because after reading up on doing this conversion myself, using all the sources available, there was a load of stuff I never knew until actually carried out doing the conversion.


    Things needed:

    All of these things were (and can) be sourced from eBay, car forums, friends, autojumbles, motorfactors and scrapyards.
    Type 9 gearbox 0-£5,000+ (eBay, scrapyards, burtons + more)
    Out of any 5 speed RWD ford, Sierras, Capri's, Cortina's, and Granada 's. Best bet is to get one already mated to a pinto engine, you can use the 2.8i one from a Capri , but you need to either get the input shaft machined, or swap it over from a type 9. general consensus is that these gearboxes are the best because the ratios are equal to the mk2 escort rs1800, with an added 5 th gear, a lot of people find that there's too much of a gap between the 1 st and 2nd gear with the type 9, but if you've ever driven a car with a type 9 in, then you can be the judge of that.




    Propshaft £20-100 (eBay, burtons, rally design + more)

    You'll need the shorter RS propshaft, depending on what axle you are running will depend on what propshaft you will need, for the non RS back axle you have to use the pre-rs2000 custom propshaft, as the flange is a different size. If your using an RS axle then an RS propshaft will do, either single piece or 2 piece will do the trick, there are arguments for and against each propshaft, but I ran the 2 piece one mainly because it puts less stress on the gearbox (or so I have heard), but there are arguments that the single piece is stronger, up to you, but I don't think there's a lot of difference


    Quickshift gearstick or adaptor £60 (full stick) or £15 (adaptor) (burtons)

    Otherwise the gearstick hits off the handbrake lever, for a while I just bent the stick forward so it didn't hit it. But this isn't a great way of doing it; needless to say I went out and paid the £15 from burtons for the adaptor plate.


    Clutch (£15-£50) (motorfactors, halfords, and burtons)

    You'll need a sierra (or Capri I think) 1600 OHC, 5 speed, 23spline, 190mm clutch plate. I went to most local places to find one and they only sold them as a kit, which includes a clutch pressure plate and a release bearing, the release bearing can be used, and should really be changed when you change the clutch anyways.


    Bellhousing (£50-200) (eBay, burtons, forums)

    I've heard this doesn't necessarily need changing, but have also been told that if you don't you have to ‘persuade' the start of the tunnel with a big hammer, as it isn't quite wide enough, I binned the cast one for an RS Bellhousing, mainly because one came along at the right price at the right time, but also because they are lighter, and smaller, so fit into the standard mk2 tunnel without mods. Remembering if you do change it, you'll need to either bin or modify the dust cover (ill talk more about that below) and work out how to connect the clutch cable up, as there isn't a hole on the Crossflow engine where the cable would normally sit on the pinto.

    Standard Capri Bellhousing – RS2000 alloy Bellhousing – Crossflow
    Bellhousing


    Dust cover N/A (home made)

    The RS2000 has the dust cover as part of the sump, this isn't the case with the Crossflow, and they use a metal sandwich plate that sits between engine and gearbox. I've heard of a lot of people not running them without much quibbles, but I wouldn't recommend doing this as it's clearly there for a reason. Instead I ended up modifying my dust cover with the correct cut outs for the clutch cable bracket and the starter motor. Ideally I would spend time fabricating the correct bits onto the dust cover.

    Modified dust cover (bit missing from where starter motor goes)


    Clutch cable bracket (0-£10) (RetroFord)

    I used an alternator bracket for this task, as it was the correct shape for the job and plenty strong enough. But I've recently seen ones being made by RetroFord for there Zetec conversions that would do the correct job ( http://www.retro-ford.co.uk/ )






    Speedo cable (£3.25) (halfords)

    You need a longer Speedo cable, mainly because the Speedo sender sits further back, you can use the standard one, but it stretches the cable a little, and for under £4 its not going to break the bank, just don't lose the circlip because this isn't included. You'll need a sierra one.


    Gearbox mounting bracket £0-10 (scrapyards, eBay)

    There are 2 methods as to how to do this, either carefully move the old ones back, or cut them off and attach it through the floor pan. I mounted it through the floorpan, and unless your cars worth a few quid and you don't want to go hacking up the floorpan fitting a new gearbox, id suggest you do it this way, because it's a lot easier. If you use the original mounts, but moved further back, then you use the original escort mount as it's the correct width for the brackets. If you mount it through the floorpan, then you will need a Capri/sierra mount.



    Floorpan bracket for above N/A

    You need to weld 2 set of plates with 2 pieces of threaded rod coming from them, in order for you to mount the gearbox through the floorpan, I've seen a few conversions where the person has simply used bolts, but for one, I think this would pull your floorpan about a bit, and 2, leave little lumps in the carpet where the bolts heads stick up. Plus you'll need some 25mm spacers.


    How the gearbox needs to be mounted through the floor, and brackets + spacers


    Clutch release arm. £23 (ford)

    You can buy a pattern one from burtons for £25 inc VAT and inc delivery, which brings it nearer £40. alternatively you can buy a genuine one from ford for £23 inc VAT.

    Standard rs2000 release arm

    1. First remove the front half of the interior, front seats, carpet centre console.

    2. You will want to jack the car up as high as you can, front and back, I used ramps on the back and some big logs for the front (not going to move this way!)


    2. Remove the gearbox, ill not go into that, that's what the Haynes manual is for, that includes starter motor and propshaft.

    3 remove clutch and replace with new one, once again, this is what the Haynes manual is for.

    4. The gearstick hole sits further back with the type 9 gearbox, so you'll have to modify it to fit. A lot of people just cut it as an oval and leave it at that, I done it the proper way and marked it out as below:

    This is after welding, but basically I marked out an oval, with the gearstick hole at the top of the oval, turned it around an welded it back in, the new oval should be 24cm from the edge of the handbrake hole to the edge of the gearstick hole, so you can make the appropriate oval from that (I did). Also, I found that for marking it out, a standard CD is exactly the right size for the curve at the tops and bottoms of the oval, as it's the size of the hole, plus about 10mm each side.
    Also, you'll find underneath there's a strengthening gusset right in the way of the new hole, I had bad feelings about cutting through this, but when I had a look at pictures of a standard mk2 RS shell, the underneath of the hole looked like this:

    That's the standard mk2 RS shell, which clearly shows a big chunk cut out of the gusset, and if it's good enough for an RS, then it's good enough for my lowly Crossflow. So I just cut through it and added a little bit of metal to complete the box section I cut out, whether you want to do something different then that's your decision.
    Mine looks like this:



    5. Cut out the old gearbox mounts. This is a pain, and means sitting under the car with an angle grinder whizzing about a foot away from your face. These need cutting away because they foul the type 9 gearbox. Goggles are a must!


    6. Lower engine down. This is done by replacing, one by one, the 4 crossmember bolts, they are a 5/8 UNF thread they need to be a lot longer. You basically replace them one by one, and then undo them all slowly so that it lowers the crossmember down, but without removing it from the car, makes fitting the gearbox a lot easier because you have about 1-2” more space above it.

    7. You should have attached the clutch bracket, to the Bellhousing and Bellhousing to the gearbox. Lift it all into position and bolt it back onto the engine the same way you took it off. I put the gearbox on a skateboard, with blocks of wood underneath it to support it and get it into position, then used a scissor jack to raise the gearbox into position.

    8. Once it's bolted into place attach the gearbox bracket back onto the gearbox.
    Find out where the holes need to go for the mounts and drill them.
    Then put the mounts you've made through the holes from the interior side, on the other side add the spacers and bolt it into position – add or subtract spacers to get the box to the correct height, generally they should be about an inch, but that will vary depending on mount or how you want it sitting.


    9. Replace Propshaft. If you are using the 2 piece Propshaft you will need to space it accordingly – usually the same amount as the gearbox. Of course you don't have to do this with the single piece prop.

    10. replace all the other bits; speedo, clutch, gearstick, and so on.

    11. add gearbox oil.

    12. Before I put all of the interior in I just bolted the driver's seat in and took it for a spin just to make sure there were no unusual knocking noises or vibrations – everything seemed fine.

    13. Bolt back the rest of the interior and other bits you've broken or faffed with.
    Last edited by seventynine; 30-04-2006 at 22:29.
    http://itsalmosttime.co.uk/blog/

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    Racer Decade Plus User Paul_G's Avatar

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    Re: Type 9 gearbox tutorial

    Great thread, I was going to do something like this on a website but never got around to it
    Here is a picture to compare propshafts. The single piece is a lot stronger, look how thin it is at the donut section arrowed on the 2 piece, I have heard horror stories of these snapping


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    World Champion Decade Plus User RChambers's Avatar

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    Re: Type 9 gearbox tutorial

    Doubt you will have trouble at normal power levels. I give my zetec proper stick and the prop hasn't ever worried me. The axle or gearbox would break long before the prop I would think!

    She's built like a Steakhouse, but handles like a Bistro

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    Re: Type 9 gearbox tutorial

    anyway i can edit this, ive been pointed out a few errors that need sorting

    namely:

    the 2.0l front shaft does not fit the 2.8i box as the front bearing is smaller and i think the gear is different

    cortina's did not have 5 speed's fitted to them

    all the diff flanges on mk11 are the same size only the mk1's are smaller

    you can also use a talbot sunbeam clutch plate

    if you leave the cast bellhousing it has the hole already for the cutch cable and is the same size as the rs alloy one just heavier

    you can also push the tunnel out with a jack or porta power so the monts miss the gearbox and save removing them


    thanks to AndyG pointing them out to me
    http://itsalmosttime.co.uk/blog/

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    Spam Man mk1 gaz's Avatar

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    Re: Type 9 gearbox tutorial

    good useful advise there mate , 10/10 and a gold star to you The type 9 box is always slated for it's short 1st gear then long 2nd gear but this has some benefits . !st one is just get the car rolling from a standstill and then smash the lever into second and hold on tight , and the 2nd benefit is that second gear doughnuts and powerslides are sooooooo sweet it hurts , so £50 well spent i say

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    Re: Type 9 gearbox tutorial

    Only the 4 pot T9s have the big gap between 1st and 2nd (and so do the 4sp), 2.8 has a closer gearset, as do the early sierra 5 speeds but they also use the smaller 1.6 clutch
    Granada T9 (Mk3) use a leccy speedo drive not a cable drive.
    Dam good artical mate
    This might be of some use to somone

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    World Champion Decade Plus User Mk2Matt's Avatar

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    Re: Type 9 gearbox tutorial

    Great thread there mate, very useful info! This is something I will eventually get around to doing with mine, there is only so long you can sit on a motorway and listen to the xflow screaming at 5000rpm for an hour or so for!!!

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    Re: Type 9 gearbox tutorial

    Think you missed that if you have an auto shell the brackets are in the right place and a type 9 can be bolted straight up using the auto mount. Also burtons sell alloy spacers but I cant remember if that was for if you had a pinto engine or not.

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    Re: Type 9 gearbox tutorial

    4. The gearstick hole sits further back with the type 9 gearbox, so you'll have to modify it to fit.


    Also, you'll find underneath there's a strengthening gusset right in the way of the new hole, I had bad feelings about cutting through this,


    Just a tip as i dont think its wise to mess with the strength of the shell. I wonder if all rs shells are cut away like that?!
    My t9 in my Mk 2 shell was modified to fit the car instead of the car modified to fit the gearbox. Basically the base of the gearlever (above the output shaft) was sliced off and brought forward. my gearstick is perfectly aligned to the ORIGINAL gearlever hole in the car. The gusset is UNTOUCHED. The gearstick input shaft (is that the right term) was shortened by the same amount of material removed from the gearbox casing. Sorry i cant upload the pics but drop me a line if intrested in how it looks; maybe i can email some one the pics for posting
    Regards,
    Kevin

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    Re: Type 9 gearbox tutorial

    yeah, all the RS shells are like that, i asked about it on many forums, and every one is cut away.

    your idea sounds like the better option, but also sounds expensive.

    plus if you reweld the gusset appropriatly i cant see why it cant be just as strong if not stronger than standard.

    nice one for the info tho
    http://itsalmosttime.co.uk/blog/

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    Re: Type 9 gearbox tutorial

    Heres a blinder of a tip for this one- i bolted my x-flow in with RS2000 alloy engine mounts(yes they do fit straight onto the x-flow) and the advantage of this is that it lowers the engine slightly, thus bringing the box down slightly, and gives much needed clearnace for a standard cast bellhousing


    Real men do it Sideways

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    Re: Type 9 gearbox tutorial

    Another option is to space the cross member by about 5mm with some angle iron and replacing the x-member bolts with 5mm longer thread. That way you don't need to loosten the x-member every time. Works well for me.

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    Re: Type 9 gearbox tutorial

    a few images of my t9 which was modified for correct gearstick alignment. allowing me to retain the strength of the gusset and use the original gearlever hole.



    Regards,
    Kevin

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    Spanner Monkey redracer's Avatar

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    Re: Type 9 gearbox tutorial

    Some more info on the subject courtesy of classicrsfords.co.uk, there's a nice graph showing the various types to fit to your engine capacity and what is required. On the link is a word doc with more info.
    http://www.classicrsfords.co.uk/5speed_conversion.htm

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    Re: Type 9 gearbox tutorial

    Quote Originally Posted by lincolndanny
    Heres a blinder of a tip for this one- i bolted my x-flow in with RS2000 alloy engine mounts(yes they do fit straight onto the x-flow) and the advantage of this is that it lowers the engine slightly, thus bringing the box down slightly, and gives much needed clearnace for a standard cast bellhousing
    Dannys right but when i tried it on mine it was about an inch or so away from the xmember at one side so i think you need to use two longer rubber mounts instead of the one lone one short

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    Re: Type 9 gearbox tutorial

    I have got a mk2 escort automatic and want to convert this to a manual.
    Now I've heard that the propshaft of the auto box is the right length for a mk9, but this isnt mensiond here. so I was wondering if anybody knows if this is true The gearbox mountings are the same for the auto and mk9 so if the propshaft is the right length, it will go in a treat.popcorn:
    only have to sort out the pedal box then

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    World Champion Decade Plus User RChambers's Avatar

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    Re: Type 9 gearbox tutorial

    yeah auto and rs2000 props are the same length

    She's built like a Steakhouse, but handles like a Bistro

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    Re: Type 9 gearbox tutorial

    thanks m8, type 9 is going in then

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    Re: Type 9 gearbox tutorial

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul_G View Post
    The single piece is a lot stronger, look how thin it is at the donut section arrowed on the 2 piece, I have heard horror stories of these snapping

    actually it's as thin as in 2wd sierra cosworth.

    i have a prop with 2wd cosworth front section and mk1 escort rear section bolted together. it's a bolt on job.
    Cheers, Tepi

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    Re: Type 9 gearbox tutorial

    does any one have any idea what sort of speed you can get out of 1st gear with a standard type 9 vs 2.8i type 9? (ive got a 4.1 diff) the reason i ask is my ecu has launch control but only works in 1st. so though it would be good to find out if its worth getting the 2.8i box before i put in my standard one?

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    Re: Type 9 gearbox tutorial

    im planning on doing this conversion with a 2l pinto into a mk1 but was going to use a sierra mount rather than a capri one does the spacer still need to be 25mm?

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    Racer Decade Plus User NRspeed's Avatar

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    Re: Type 9 gearbox tutorial

    I have done it using the Rs two piece prop on a RS pinto 160bhp, had no problems at all.
    CheeRS Nat

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    Re: Type 9 gearbox tutorial

    Hi Guys

    I fitted a Type 9 into my MK2 Sport.It has transformed the driveability of my car even though I run 15" inch wheels with 195/50/15 tyres.Only problem is the speedo over reads by about 20kmh, is there another speedo drive gear I can use.

    Cheers

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    Spanner Monkey redracer's Avatar

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    Re: Type 9 gearbox tutorial

    Quote Originally Posted by Gavin RS View Post
    Hi Guys

    I fitted a Type 9 into my MK2 Sport.It has transformed the driveability of my car even though I run 15" inch wheels with 195/50/15 tyres.Only problem is the speedo over reads by about 20kmh, is there another speedo drive gear I can use.

    Cheers
    For the SA market there were 3 different types of gears used and I think they were colour coded too May just be a case of finding some to test

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    Racer Decade Plus User wildo105e's Avatar

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    Re: Type 9 gearbox tutorial

    Great timing with the thread. I picked up a box this weekend to put in my new project MK1 however I have had a look at and the speedo drive is electrical i.e two wires driven by a motor from the speedo drive Is this a late box etc. Can I convert to cable ?

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    Re: Type 9 gearbox tutorial

    Yes, it's no problem converting electronic speedo drive to mechanical. Just remove the lectric sender and fit manual parts instead. Or just run a bike speedo!

    Gustaf

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    Racer Decade Plus User wildo105e's Avatar

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    Re: Type 9 gearbox tutorial

    Is the mechanical one a whole unit that would just replace the existing leccy one. From the piccys in the thread does the drive come out on the drivers or passenger for the mechanical one or are the tail housings the same just a straight swap anyone got some good pictures to show of the cable type. I'm sure this is going to occur again for someone

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    Re: Type 9 gearbox tutorial

    The tail housin is the same, you just remove the electronic sender and as far as I remember you can just connect the cable. May have to swap in a cable gear, not sure...

    But it's quite self explanatory when you remove the parts.

    Gustaf

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    Racer Decade Plus User wildo105e's Avatar

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    Re: Type 9 gearbox tutorial

    I have had a look at my 99p haynes manual for sierras. It looks lkike the speedo gear is replaced and then a cap is tapped in over the top of this. I think these should be available from Ford fairly cheap as speedo gears do tend to break at some point. I will attempt this at some point.

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    Racer Decade Plus User wildo105e's Avatar

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    Re: Type 9 gearbox tutorial

    Bought a speedo drive and cap from ford, rubber seal and circlip no longer available. Looking at the haynes book the drive goes in ok but in my box there is no outlet for it to pass into so i have a tail housing that will only do electronic. I think the lesson is always check the housing from the speedo drive. Although there should be a glut of Granada boxes for the track cars.

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    Re: Type 9 gearbox tutorial

    When going to 5 speed i allways just stuck the speedo drive out of the box i was replcing.

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    Racer Decade Plus User wildo105e's Avatar

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    Re: Type 9 gearbox tutorial

    Took these piccies to show what I mean as my gearbox goes not have the out put for a mechanical speedo It look likes a type 9 to me but if not what is it? What is not tooo clear is leccy sender in the 2nd picture
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails DSC01795.JPG‎  

    DSC01796.JPG‎  


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    Re: Type 9 gearbox tutorial

    Looks like classic ford this month confirms it is indeed a Granada box. I will just guess how fast i am going by the deafening rpm of a stripped cabin

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    Re: Type 9 gearbox tutorial

    Hi i'm hoping to do this conversion. But...

    I have got a decent type 9 box and a knackered one. However i think the decent one is possibly a 4x4box, it doesn't have the rear housing on it...

    Can i just put the rear housing form the normal type 9 onto it?

    The front of the gearbox also has an extra bit with three bolts in it just below the round bit around the input shaft, this is preventing me from fitting the bell-housing.

    Also i don't have both boxes with me but to compare, would the length of the 4x4 ones input-shaft be to long as for the 2.8 boxes... If so could i then fit a spacer in between the bell housing and box...

    I found this seven site that looked like they had a similar box but for an XR4i

    http://www.se7enup.hopto.org/se7enup...p?id=11&mnu=11

    Any help greatly appreciated

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    Re: Type 9 gearbox tutorial

    If its a 4x4 box then it will be a mt75, as far as im aware the t9 was a rwd box only

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    Re: Type 9 gearbox tutorial

    i thought there was a 2.8 4x4 im sure i saw a few when i was looking for a regular 2.8box, and they definatly wernt the mt75 as they had the cast iron maincase not the all alloy with integral bellhousing like the mt75. i am pretty sure there was never a 4x4 2liter T9 box.

    havent got a clue if you can take the transfer case off the back and put a normal tailhousing on.. the 2.8box also needs the input shaft machining, or a spacer but that means the gearstick is another 30mm ish further back.

    there is another thread about the 2.8 box, which might help as i think the differences between 2.8 and 2.0 T9 boxes is internal so i'd asume youd have to put a tailhousing from a 2.8 on a 2.8 maincase

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    Re: Type 9 gearbox tutorial

    yeah the type 9 was used in the xr4x4 so that will be what you have. the extra piece on the front is for the stronger roller bearings which most v6 boxes have.

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    Re: Type 9 gearbox tutorial

    the casings (apart from the hole on the front) are the same on the v6 models and the 2.0 so you could swap the tail sections over mate
    but you will need a v6 bellhousing or 'modify' one to accommodate the bearing stub on the front

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    Re: Type 9 gearbox tutorial

    It's probably been mentioned in this thread somewhere, but as I'm too lazy to read all of it, what clutch is needed for a type 9 to x/flow?

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    Re: Type 9 gearbox tutorial

    you want a 190mm 23 spline one, i think its from a 1.8 sierra, but not sure

    quite a few places do them, speedshack, peter lloyd, burtons, and plenty of others

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