capri v sierra type 9 gearbox

[mk1 gaz]

Is a 2.8 capri type 9 gearbox stronger than a 2.0 sierra type 9 gearbox ? I know the input shafts are different sizes and the ratio's are different but can anyone tell me anymore info please

[tim]

i thought they were the sme strength , the p100 was the stronger box, an ally top cover helps with strength

[eric]

The 2.8 box was allways designed to cope with more power, if the early 2.8 4 speed fits then use that gearbox, it's the best choice.

[david_white]

I think youre talking about 100 bhp more than a 2.8i capri though Gaz so I cant see how a type 9 is strong enough without something like Tran x internals?

[mk1 gaz]

I was thinking about the 2.8 type 9 because it has got a good set of ratio's for my engine and it's intended road use . It's 3.36 first gear is better and closer to second gear compared to the 3.65 1st geared 2.0 type 9 gearbox . I was hopng that it would be stronger than the 2.0 version as it was used on the biggest engine ford had at the time . All the type 9 aftermarket gear kits i've seen are for rallying and have got a long 2.3 first gear or worst . My new engine needs to rev between 5000-9000 rpm to get into it's power band so a long first gear will bogg it down from standstill Would using the alloy top plate from rally design make any difference on it's own to the gearboxes strength ? I've seen that rally design also sell a close ratio type 9 rebuilt gearbox for £650 but this has the exact ratio's of the 2.8 version , is this just one of those gearboxes after all ?

[david_white]

If you dont mind the noise get a tranx or quaife type 9, theres usually some good second hand ones around, or if you buy a new gear kit you can choose the ratios that suit the engine best.
If you dont want a noisy box I can only see a T5 lasting the duration with all that power, type 9's just aint that strong as std, even 160bhp+ would be pushing your luck.

Try www.gearboxman.co.uk for all the alternatives, he does quaife, tranx and his own uprated boxes

[Zetec_Escorts]

The strongest production Type 9 was the late XR4i box. Not as tough as the MT75, but a lot stronger than the standard box.

[mk1 gaz]

cheers fella's

[Nige S]

My mk1 mex runs a sierra 2 litre and 1st gear is far too low, pulling away quickly sends the tacho into the red almost immediately and then your fighting to change up into 2nd against the revs.
The 5th gear is a godsend on motorway driving, cutting down on the noise of the twin 40's and improving mpg (slightly).

[Retromotorsport]

Gaz is on that slippery slope....

"to cut ot not to cut , that is the question, wether 'tis nobler to suffer the broken gears and rings of outdated type 9's, Or to take a cutters and welders to the troubles.... And by fitting the T5 To die for... to sleep...
No more... and by a sleep to say we end
The heart-ache and the thousand natural shocks of spending fortunes on gearboxes"

Ok there may be a bit of "wagger daggers" Hamlet in there , but i would jump straight to the T5 .. peace of mind etc

[mk1 gaz]

i've looked at the T5 cossie gearbox and there are some major problems with it ............too big and heavy and it won't fit in my car without cutting it up , the gear ratio's are crap , the decent gear ratio's are £950 + fitting , and they're all knacked and expensive , apart from that lot i'd get one !!!!!

[Retromotorsport]

Gaz , your brilient ...

£1900 for your T5 with a chice of ratios from Bernie... no rebuilds needed.. unlike a Quaife T9

Also... watch out for the T9 shattering its case, bending the crank... etc

[RChambers]

So you will spend £6K on a race spec engine but you don't want to spend more than £50 get that power to the wheels Think how hard you will cry when the gearbox locks up under full power and foobars the engine If you could get decent gear ratios for the MT75 it would be the ideal box as its an all alloy light gearbox and much stronger than a type 9. Unfortunately the standard ratios are shite and its a big box so you will need a bigger gearbox tunnel. If you don't want to cut the car the only option is gonna be about a grands worth of second hand trans-x/quaife type 9...

[mk1 gaz]

Gaz , your brilient ...

£1900 for your T5 with a chice of ratios from Bernie... no rebuilds needed.. unlike a Quaife T9

Also... watch out for the T9 shattering its case, bending the crank... etc

if i get a gearbox from bernie i'll still be waiting this time next year for it !!!!! i've asked him already , Fooooookin slow motion over there

[mk1 gaz]

So you will spend £6K on a race spec engine but you don't want to spend more than £50 get that power to the wheels Think how hard you will cry when the gearbox locks up under full power and foobars the engine If you could get decent gear ratios for the MT75 it would be the ideal box as its an all alloy light gearbox and much stronger than a type 9. Unfortunately the standard ratios are shite and its a big box so you will need a bigger gearbox tunnel. If you don't want to cut the car the only option is gonna be about a grands worth of second hand trans-x/quaife type 9...

£8000+ engine package for £3800 with dry sump , throttle bodies , e.c.u. , etc, cheaper than a modded zetec but twice as fast !!!! I'm thinking of using a tranx type 9 gearbox as there's no cutting required and all the fast motors around here have got them and they don't break them , andy harris , ron harris , darran moss , dean watt and many more are all using them to great effect with english axles

[andypipe]

if i get a gearbox from bernie i'll still be waiting this time next year for it !!!!! i've asked him already , Fooooookin slow motion over there

Not for me though. I drop something off, 2 days later i get a call to pick it up

[andypipe]

I'm thinking of using a tranx type 9 gearbox as there's no cutting required and all the fast motors around here have got them and they don't break them , andy harris , ron harris , darran moss , dean watt and many more are all using them to great effect with english axles

They are obviously not driving them hard enough

[Graham]

gaz you say you dont want a long 1st gear, but why not? gearboxes with long 1sts are intended for use with low diff ratios, if your new yb revs to hell and back it will need a low diff ratio or top gear will be unuseable, if your new engine peaks at around 8,000rpm, that would be around 180mph in top gear which is way too long, so you will need a low diff ratio, which will make a long 1st gear useable

[mk1 gaz]

graham i've got a 4:1 diff and 50 series 13 inch tyres so the gearing is low enough . At present with a standard type 9 gearbox i'm doing 100 mph at 7000 rpm in 5th gear . The new engine needs to rev between 5000-9000 to get in the power band or it will bogg down . I'm not interested in top speed so even 115 mph is fast enough but i must have serious acceleration up to this point . As the gearboxes to suit the engines power are expensive i don't want to buy one which will kill the engines acceleration . I'm worried that the long 1st gears will do this by bogging the engine down . My standard gearbox has a 3.65 1st gear which wakes up the engine as soon as i move but most of the secondhand uprated gearboxes i've seen have 2 to 2.3 1st gears in them where i would like nearer 3 . The tranx type 9 gearbox 2.48 1st gear is the best i can get at present so this looks like what i'll have to use . I can't use any of the big strong T5 gearboxes etc because i'll need my car cut up to fit them in , which is grief , expensive , my carpets etc won't fit and i'll still need a gearkit anyway ....................

[Graham]

graham i've got a 4:1 diff and 50 series 13 inch tyres so the gearing is low enough . At present with a standard type 9 gearbox i'm doing 100 mph at 7000 rpm in 5th gear . The new engine needs to rev between 5000-9000 to get in the power band or it will bogg down . I'm not interested in top speed so even 115 mph is fast enough but i must have serious acceleration up to this point . them in , which is grief , expensive , my carpets etc won't fit and i'll still need a gearkit anyway ....................

gaz that makes all the more case for a long 1st and low diff, like 4.4 or lower, incidently a long first gear is stonger than a shorter one as there is less size differential between the sizes of the two gears that make up each ratio

[Retromotorsport]

175/50/13 .... 0.89:1 5th.... 4.1:1 diff... = 113.57 @7000 rpm

[mk1 gaz]

175/50/13 .... 0.89:1 5th.... 4.1:1 diff... = 113.57 @7000 rpm

mr retro , my standard type 9 top gear is 0.82 . I managed to get 108 mph at brunters when flat out at full throttle for a far bit , this was verified by the V-box timing gear . With the new tranx 5th gear of 0.87 and the new engine reving to nearer 9000 rpm what would the top speed be please

[Retromotorsport]

I'll work it later ... i'm off home .. too piging hot after welding up Turbo pipes

[Dave]

With the new tranx 5th gear of 0.87 and the new engine reving to nearer 9000 rpm what would the top speed be please

149mph if I put the right numbers in.

Download this prog and play to your hearts content

http://locost7.info/gearcalc.php

[mk1 gaz]

149mph if I put the right numbers in.

Download this prog and play to your hearts content

http://locost7.info/gearcalc.php

oooooh no !!!!! i need brakes then .............

[alladdin]

ive just found a company on ebay flogging what seems to be a std 2.8 box as a close ratio one. seller main_train www.maintrainltd.com ?? anyone heard of em??

[Graham]

i didn't realise you had a 4.1 in it, but even with that theretical the top end would be close on 150mph,

so the diff needs to be lower, much lower if you are truly interested in acceration only, which would make sense of a long first gear

[mk1 gaz]

cheers fellas , even if it could do 150 mph with the gearing i won't be going that fast in it !!! ...................

[RChambers]

Yeah cos you can't get to that sort of speed on a 1/4 mile

[mk1 gaz]

you can on the motorway up there !!!!

[mk1 gaz]

This is really pissing me off now , because of the power the engines producing and the type 9 bell housing and clutch diameter is small i'll have to use a full race paddle clutch . I don't want one of them bastard things for sure , it looks like my cars going to get cut up for a T5 after all then so i can have a normal clutch . It's like a bad dream ...

[RChambers]

Either get an auto tunnel (tight squeeze) and carpet to match or get Gary to do you a big tunnel that looks standard then get someone to make up a new carpet to fit

[mk1 gaz]

ok a big tunnel is what i need then . Mr retro do you make / sell tunnels for a t5 box to fit a mk1 escort please ? My cars in the bodyshop now so cutting it up at present would be ideal , i could get one off you at the essex meet or pop over and pick it up .

[andypipe]

Sounds like this 230bhp N/A is gonna blow your 5 grand out of the window. Good luck with the build

[Kevmk2]

I got my round type big tunnel from that place in scotland i think £45 it was and looks nicer than the square one they do.

T5 box's dont like high revs and quick gear change's though,well mine dont If i go up to 7500rpm or more in 2nd and change gear quick it crunches,but thats probably the baulk rings.
If your going for a brenie box dont go for the bronze selectors,thats what dingy did and has had loads of problems with it,stick with the standard selectors and it should be fine.
Or go for a Type 9 box with alloy casing and alloy top plate. With a 2.48 first gear or lower.

[mk1 gaz]

kev i was about to by the tranx 2.48 1st geared type 9 gearbox when i found out the grim clutch news . Due to the serious launches and big bhp atmo cossie power the small diameter type 9 clutch won't cope unless i use a really aggressive paddle clutch . Mines a road car so that's not what i want but i also don't what a T5 cossie gearbox if it won't change gear at 9000 rpm . So what else can i do then ?

[Retromotorsport]

Sorry Gaz .. i only retail out 2 things ... towing eyes and battery/extinguisher pull cable boxes ..

Most of the other big guys have copied my rounder style tunnels now so any off them can supply you one.

[Graham]

kev i was about to by the tranx 2.48 1st geared type 9 gearbox when i found out the grim clutch news . Due to the serious launches and big bhp atmo cossie power the small diameter type 9 clutch won't cope unless i use a really aggressive paddle clutch . Mines a road car so that's not what i want but i also don't what a T5 cossie gearbox if it won't change gear at 9000 rpm . So what else can i do then ?

gaz you should get away with a pinto sized cerametalic paddle clutch, provided you get a sprung one rather than a rigid plate, rigid ones are totally on/off, the sprungs are still sharp but much more user friendly

[mk1 gaz]

cheers fellas , so this is what i've been told so far . The £350 cossie T5 gearbox is strong enough but won't change gear at high rpm unless it has the £900ish straight cut gear set plus a rebuild , a hydraulic clutch conversion at say £300 , a big fooooook off tunnel £40 + say £200 to fit , an uprated cossie clutch at £300 , a new prop shaft £150 , etc but i would have a nice road car type clutch . The type 9 way involves a £1100 brand new straight cut gearbox direct from tranx , a paddle clutch at about £300 , a new cossie crank to type 9 flywheel at £200 but no cutting of the car to fit or prop shaft mods etc . This gearbox will change gear at high rpm but i'll have a on / off clutch action which is not ideal for a road car but i have no choice really . Can you get a special bell housing that takes the big diameter cossie flywheel and clutch but bolts onto a type 9 gearbox ? ..........

[Graham]

. Can you get a special bell housing that takes the big diameter cossie flywheel and clutch but bolts onto a type 9 gearbox ? ..........

not that i know of, if the bellhousing was big enough to take the cossy flywheel it would be too big to go in the escort tunnel, i thinkkkkkkkkkk