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Thread: mk1 1700 rolling resto

  1. #1
    I used to be: steely dan Decade Plus User
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    mk1 1700 rolling resto

    well seeing as im waiting for mr dvla man to give me back my V5, and CTS to finish building my gearbox as well as everything else (rear disk conversion and megajolt), i thought id finally get round to having a look at my dads shorrock supercharger. This is likely to be a very long term project.. but I’ll probably use this thread to log all the other stuff I do to the car in the mean time. My car to date is in the your retro's section here.

    the story so far: the supercharger was removed from my dads Vauxhall viva road rally car about 30 years ago because it kept melting pistons and generally being an arse, he then put it in a nice dry barn where it lived until someone broke in and stole some farm equipment, he then moved it to a storage garage and left it under an old vintage car (this was about 17 years ago) unfortunately he didn’t put it at the back on a shelf, instead it was left on the floor not far from the door which wouldn’t close and so being in the middle of the peak district saw a fair amount of harsh Derbyshire weathering.

    he then let on a while ago in a discussion about his rallying days that he still had it, and where it was.. bargain im thinking what better then a period bolt on to add to my car, however its not looking to tidy now. being mainly alloy it isnt as bad as it could be. but thats only externally... i then found that Allards (who were dealers/specialists in Shorrock superchargers back in the 60s) are still going, and better still Alan Allard the very man who installed the supercharger to my dads car is still running the company.. so some emails and phone calls later im a little more clued up as to what i need to look for and check to see if my supercharger is usable.

    so armed with some ancient photocopied photocopies of someone’s photocopy of the disassembly instructions i set to having a peek inside:



    from the outside it doesn’t look too good, but if you rub the alloy bits it comes up ok, I think from the way its corroded the SU took most of the weathering, which is good as its closed and should have stopped all the crap getting into the blower.



    well the instructions were pretty useless, half the text was missing and you couldn’t make out what was in the pictures, I knew the backplate would have to come off, as its held together that way, and all the bolts came out with minimal effort so I could remove the SU and outlet pipe.. but the backplate wouldn’t come off, looking at the instructions and piecing bits together I was trying to take off the wrong end, not only that but I need a ‘two 3/16ths whitworth removal screws’. And the pulley and nut holding it on are rusted to hell.



    but having a cheeky look down the ports it actually dosnt look too bad, the bits I could get at cleaned up with no surface corrosion.. but really I need to get into it properly to tell as im guessing the worst bits will be where the steel vanes have contact corroded with the alloy bits.

    But my main problem is where to get some whitworth removal screws from, they don’t have them anywhere I looked, the only thing I could think of would be to buy a 3/16ths whitworth die and make my own from some bar, if anyone could help id greatly appreciate it , as its pointless sending it to someone to rebuild if its nackered and taking the backplate of is relatively simple.


    and sorry for rambling on

  2. #2
    I used to be: steely dan Decade Plus User
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    Re: mk1 1300 super (maybe)

    righty, well my cars finally gone into the garage to have some work done.. unfortunatly my digi cam has broke so i no pictures but i'll take plenty when i get a new one, big list of bits going on to the car which should mean its good and reliable for the summer:
    • auto tunnel
    • 2.8 box machined input shaft and rebuilt by CTS
    • alloy bellhousing
    • new PLR prop
    • recon 4.4 diff (will swap to 3.89 for long trips)
    • rear disk conversion
    • rad chopped/moved forward and the bulkhead modded a bit
    • oil cooler and stat oil plate
    • megajolt (eventually when ive got some cash)

    i still plan to get the supercharger on there, within a couple of years... after seeing one at the Ace on a minty sprite its favoured over a zetec or any other engine conversion, ultimately funds will dictate that one tho

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    Spam Man mk1 gaz's Avatar

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    Re: mk1 1300 super (maybe)

    Quote Originally Posted by steely dan View Post
    well seeing as im waiting for mr dvla man to give me back my V5, and CTS to finish building my gearbox
    C.T.S. gearbox rebuilds can be timed by eclipses , they're as fooooooooking slow as anything .

  4. #4
    I used to be: steely dan Decade Plus User
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    Re: mk1 1300 super (maybe)

    i think it was about 2 months from when i dropped the box off to when they delivered it... if id hastled them im pretty sure it would have been back within 2 weeks, but i wasnt in a rush. and they charged me considerably less than the nearest quote i could get. not too bad as long as its organised that way

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    Spam Man mk1 gaz's Avatar

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    Re: mk1 1300 super (maybe)

    2 months must by a record for those slow boys , your lucky

  6. #6
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    Re: mk1 1300 super (maybe)

    righty, all go on the car still, all taking longer due to excessive use of rivets and fastners on everything and it all being a combination of metric and imperial stuff. and limited photos as my camera is crap and keeps corrupting the files

    so far, engine out, tunnel chopped, auto tunnel is in, and a patch on the floor as it was rotten, most of it actually looks ok, i was expecting it to be like swis cheese.



    the gearstick hole is yet to be finished as we wanted to see exactly where that needs to be with the 'box in place.



    rad chopped, moved forward and oil cooler mounted, which leaves loads of space for whatever i decide to do in the future although the top rad hose is now too short so i'll have to either get a new one or get a thermostat housing with the exit pointing forwards





    the diff, halfshafts and back brakes are off.. halfshafts being turned down and then it can have the brackets welded on in place for the disk convertion and then re-assembled with the new diff and prop.

    then we have to refit all the interior and re-plum it all up, which should hopefully mean i have the car back by the weekend

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    I used to be: steely dan Decade Plus User
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    Re: mk1 1300 super (maybe)

    :tumblewee

    well mores been done, rear brakes are all on and linked up, just need bleeding and the bias setting up






    gearbox is mounted up all fits nicely with the capri cross member, although we had to grind a bit off the input shaft sleve thing as it was touching the clutch housing. the gearstick hole is in too, although i forgot to take a pic of that its raised slightly so the gearbox mounts nicely, will also mean thers more bulkhead clearence for future mods


    oil and water rads are fixed in, the hoses just about reach although really it could do with some new ones which fit properly gives me a good 2" of space infront of the engine


    would have been finished and back on the road this weekend but the electrics are all over the place and it shorted setting on fire nothing major, but means i have to wait till monday

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    Re: mk1 1300 super (maybe)

    Dan swap the calipers to the other side mate you have them on the wrong way handbrake should enter from the bottom, and then that way the bleed nipples are pointing up so that you can bleed them

    Otherwise looking good

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    Re: mk1 1300 super (maybe)

    cheers dave i'll swap them round asap

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    Re: mk1 1300 super (maybe)

    woot got me car back last night

    although its far from being perfect. the electrics are a bit dodgy, so im looking to get a new loom in and rewire the fuse box and all the other crap.

    the clutch cable jumped off the pedal twice this morning which wasnt fun, i got to work covered in shite, but at least its working and i have me car back

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    Racer Decade Plus User andypipe's Avatar
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    Re: mk1 1300 super (maybe)

    Quote Originally Posted by mk1 gaz View Post
    2 months must by a record for those slow boys , your lucky
    I get mine back in 2 days


    Cars looking sweet by the way


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    Re: mk1 1300 super (maybe)

    Car is looking brilliant Dan
    tommy 2000

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    Re: mk1 1300 super (maybe)

    cheers guys

    Quote Originally Posted by andypipe View Post
    I get mine back in 2 days

    Cars looking sweet by the way
    to be fair to them, i gave them the gearbox and said i was in no rush, left it a month before emailing them, and when i actually gave them a deadline a couple of weeks later they got it ready in time, so i cant complain... as long as it stays in one piece its so nice haveing a close ratio box and a 4.4 diff. alot easier to drive, pulls better too

    off to think automotive on tommorow to get the oil cooler pipes, then i can get that plumbed in and give it an oil change. the handbrake need re-adjusting and the exhaust is rattling on just about everything it can, so a session with a FBH and an angle grinder will fix that.

    then i want to get the electrics done, fit a megajolt and get it all tuned up proper

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    Re: mk1 1300 super (maybe)

    after a trip to think automotive, i had a bash at hooking up the oil cooler. the plan was to go through the panel at the front with some bulkhead fittings as i thought this would be the neatest option. there are already 2 holes there, and with the aid of a circular file and 2 hours they were big enough to fit the pipes through (there is no power where the car is so i couldnt use a drill or anything )


    then chuck in a connector and link a pipe up


    fits nice without forcing the pipe through a sharp turn and hopefully no chance of it rubbing on anything


    then i realised i didnt have any spanners big enough, the car had no oil in it so i couldnt drive anywhere to get some, thankfully the local general store has a brilliant room full of cheap crappy tools, and 6 pounds later i had a wrench and adjustable spanner not ideal but they had no big spanners and i knew this would do the job


    unfortunatly i measured the pipes slightly wrong, so it is a bit tight where they go to the sandwich plate, and i may change them at a later date


    from the front you cant see any of the pipes so it looks pretty neat, and the oil stat seems to work fine so it wont over cool the oil in the winter

  15. #15
    Part of the furniture Decade Plus User Ratters's Avatar

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    Re: mk1 1300 super (maybe)

    Looking good Dan Coming along nicely mate

    How much do you reckon the complete oil cooler set up has cost you please?? PM me if you want

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    Re: mk1 1300 super (maybe)

    Quote Originally Posted by Ratters View Post
    Looking good Dan Coming along nicely mate

    How much do you reckon the complete oil cooler set up has cost you please?? PM me if you want
    cheers

    i bought the oil stat plate and cooler from ebay ages ago, i think i paid about 35quid all in, its a 15row 235mm cooler so a bit overkill, but i was having hot running issues in traffic so i need it most when im not moving too much, and the oil stat means it shouldnt over cool when moving.

    the connecting hoses cost 46quid for all bits and being swaged to the pipes.. this would be less if you used non over braided hose (but if you want to do any form of motorsport its generally reccomended that they are braided), and without the extra connecters i put in, probably around 25 i guess. i think to buy one in kit form with everything you need is about 140quid, but im not too sure. you can spend silly money if you go for the aeroquip stuff, but it does look nice

    the guys down there are well into old fords, so if you say its for a Mk1, thei'll be more than happy to help.

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    Re: mk1 1700 rolling resto

    been a while since i added to this... so i decided it didnt make much sense to fit the shorrock, looking at an expencive rebuild of both the supercharger and the engine, so i bought a 1700xflow instead still planning to strip the shorrock and rebuild it myself, no loss if its nackered that way.

    so this is the new engine, should go quite well pray: all taken to a local garage (as i dont have any way of swapping an engine myself)


    crappy phone pic of an empty engine bay


    new engine now in there just hopeing the megajolt dosnt cause too many issues, if not it'll have the dizzy put back in and i'll try and sort the megajolt myself


    hopefully i'll be running by the end of the week. and the nicest part my insurance premium didnt go up with the engine swap, why the hell i didnt do it earlier i dont know

    cheers
    dan

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    Re: mk1 1700 rolling resto

    good work dan

    what sort of spec is the engine???
    Ta

    Steve


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    Re: mk1 1700 rolling resto

    Quote Originally Posted by steveo_mex View Post
    good work dan

    what sort of spec is the engine???
    i bought it off an ad on here. it came from a locost
    1600cc 711M block +.90 (1698cc), using 1300 pistons so 10.3:1CR
    unleaded head with 41.3 inlet an GT size exhaust (stage 2 ported and gas flowed)
    Piper 270 cam
    Lightened flywheel
    1700 supersport ali rocker cover
    twin 40 dellortos
    megajolt 3d ignition

    it should be around 110bhp, but i'll have it set up properly in the new year and find out then

    it is now in and working, only the sump needs a bit more beating as its using the old 1300 one... i have a spare that i want to get big winged, but it'll do for now xmaswave

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    Re: mk1 1700 rolling resto

    Not seen this before, looking sweet dude.

    You paying someone else to do the engine swap?

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    Re: mk1 1700 rolling resto

    i changed the title since i abandoned supercharging (for now)

    yep, unfortunately living in a flat, with no garage or off street parking, an engine swap is more than i can do at the side of the road but the money i save on paying for a lockup (their about 30quid a week without power) allows me to pay someone to do work every few months

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    Re: mk1 1300 super (maybe)

    Quote Originally Posted by dangerousdave View Post
    Dan swap the calipers to the other side mate you have them on the wrong way handbrake should enter from the bottom, and then that way the bleed nipples are pointing up so that you can bleed them

    Otherwise looking good

    what calipers have you used to rear disc the axel + what discs are they aswell??xmaswave

    cheeRS

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    mk1 1700 rolling resto

    Quote Originally Posted by cjay2004 View Post
    what calipers have you used to rear disc the axel + what discs are they aswell??xmaswave

    cheeRS
    i bought it as a kit from arrow engineering but i belive it uses sierra calipers with fiesta disks.. the kit was really good all ligned up nicely

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    Re: mk1 1700 rolling resto

    right, so i had trouble getting the engine in.. or rather the guy doing it had trouble... the sumps i had were both 1300 sumps, or so i believed as they both seemed to catch on the crank/rods.. they were bashed to make sure they cleared, and whilst it didnt make a noise when turned over by hand when the engine was running it sounded like it was still hitting.

    however, the noise seemed to get worse as the engine got hotter, and it was at this point the conrod made a bid for freedom through the side of the block and out the sump





    this was supposed to be a fine running drop in and go engine the conrod bolt was thrown out the hole in the block, which would suggest to me that it worked itself loose.

    what im guessing happened, is that it may not have been tight enough before, and the minor contact its had with the sump before that was modified has loosened it more, then its basically fallen out, and the rod has gone through the block... not very fookin happy to say the least.

    hopefully its not damaged the pistons or the head, and i can just replace the block, crank and rods without it costing too much.... i could argue with the seller that they sold me a duff engine, but the fact weve swapped the sump and known its contacted that is enough for a claim not to be that valid.. you live and learn eh

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    Re: mk1 1700 rolling resto

    damn thats propper unlucky, hope u get things sorted for the next block, btw ur not on ur own cos thats the kinda luck i normally have

    xmaswavexmaswavexmaswavexmaswavexmaswave

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    Re: mk1 1700 rolling resto

    p.m. sent reguarding the x/flow i have for sale!!!

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    Re: mk1 1700 rolling resto

    Bugger!

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    Re: mk1 1700 rolling resto

    Dan i've got a spare 711 block you can have it needs cleaning up and would need to be bored to +90 but is yours if you want it

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    Re: mk1 1700 rolling resto

    And i think i have a crank and rods in stock that also need cleaning! Very shit luck, should have checked all the bolts and bearings when the sump was off

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    Re: mk1 1700 rolling resto

    cheers matt we havent stripped the engine down yet to see whats damaged. once i know i can work out whats the best/cheapest way of getting a running engine back, im trying to not spend to much

    might not be till mid Jan before i can do anything either, with xmas/new years in the way and me going on holiday after that. ive got a few options, buy a whole engine and break the bits i have to recover the cost, replace the block and rod and get it all machined to work (providing nothing else is fooked) or buy a rebuilt bottom end and swap the bits over i wont be buying some fiberglass doors in the new year tho

    yeah i kno dave.. unfortunatly i wasnt there to do it, and the guy was chasing the noise thinking it was the sump hitting, one of those things i guess

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    Re: mk1 1700 rolling resto

    finally time for an update

    managed to pick up some engine bits to replace the stuff on mine that went bang. but without a car to transport the bits i had to swallow my pride and borrow a car off my parents.. this isnt just any car... this is the worst car of all time

    but it isnt costing me anything other than fuel, has 3 months left on its MOT and will do me fine as a portable skip (literally), as i dont think it would be too easy to use public transport to carry an engine.

    and so today, i loaded it up with my old 1300xflow, and the 1700 xflow in bits. to take them to Vulcan (cheers steve , to see what needs to be done. and the best way to lower a car and made the already 'interesting' handling, super fun



    useful bits dropped of there, and the rest of the crap slung back in my skip.. once i got home i stripped the 1300 of anything thats of any use, this car also doubles as a workshop since i dont have a shed



    so now its just a matter of getting the final bits need, and maybe, just maybe in a few weeks i'll have my car back with a nice shiney 'new' engine

  32. #32
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    Re: mk1 1700 rolling resto

    like the spinners in the boot
    Rob Virgo
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    Re: mk1 1700 rolling resto

    sadly their just normal hubcaps, but shiney none the less, i cant bring myself to put them on that car tho, its bad enough as it is

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    Re: mk1 1700 rolling resto

    One of the guys i went to college with had one of those, it was a sweet car. He left it crappy beige with steel wheels on but changed over to a fiat twin cam and 5 linked axle.

    Such a fun car to drive, and a great one for p*ssing of the chavs with

    Keep up the work Dan.

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    Re: mk1 1700 rolling resto

    their actually 5linked as standard. just with bouncy springs and rubbish shocks, so the handling is appaling, so bad you get sever bodyroll pulling out of junctions, and if its windy you wobble like a jelly when your not moving .. wouldnt take much to sort, just some decent coilovers, its essentially a fiat 124 but made with russian ship steel... or something very heavy


    also forgot to say before, the cause of the rod through the block on the 1700xflow i bought, was a stripped thread on No1 conrod bolt. it basically fired the bolt out the sump, the bottom of the conrod detached and the top half went through the block... there was a small bit of contact between the head and piston but it dosnt look like its damaged either... at least it means that even if we'd checked the bottom end over, we'd have been unlikely to find that it was going to happen, one of those things i guess

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    Re: mk1 1700 rolling resto

    Those cars make reasonable money now.
    Best place to sell it, if you do, is at the docks where Russian ships come in.
    They go mad for them.

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    Re: mk1 1700 rolling resto

    Matt tells me you need his block which is in my shed?? Pm me to arrange collection if you need it

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    Re: mk1 1700 rolling resto

    yeah cheers dave im waiting on another complete engine, as the barings for that one are going to be 80quid ish, i'll let you know as soon as i hear from the guy

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    Re: mk1 1700 rolling resto

    Why whats wrong with it? Or is that the price of new bearings

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    Re: mk1 1700 rolling resto

    matt said its been bore lined (i think they did this if the mains werent right in the casting, so overbored them), it needs oversized barings to fit, different from most xflow blocks, and yeah, for them a new set is 80quid. if i can get hold of this other engine it wont cost me alot more, and i can sell the rest of the bits to get my money back, aswell as use the new baring i already have for a standard block

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