User Tag List

+ Reply to Thread
Page 3 of 4 FirstFirst 1 2 3 4 LastLast
Results 81 to 120 of 153

Thread: Holbay Cylinderhead

  1. #81
    Mechanic

    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Vic, Australia
    Posts
    662
    Thanks
    133
    Thanked 76 Times in 69 Posts

    Re: Holbay Cylinderhead

    Just in case anyone is interested, I have the flow figures from when my Holbay head flowed. As far as I am aware, it had not been messed with and is 'as per factory' The flow figures aren't that good TBH, and unfortunately all the cooling and RR gear was long gone.

    This is what I have for the Holbay head @10 inch (x1.58 for 25").

    inlet

    lift .05 .1 .15 .2 .25 .3 .35 .4 .45 .5
    17.8 34.7 52 70.5 84.4 90.8 96.1 100.6 105.3
    108.7

    Ex
    lift .05 .1 .15 .2 .25 .3 .35 .4 .45 .5
    13.6 27 39.7 48.9 57.9 66.3 71.8 75.2 75.2
    75.2



    Shaun

  2. #82
    Mechanic

    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Vic, Australia
    Posts
    662
    Thanks
    133
    Thanked 76 Times in 69 Posts

    Re: Holbay Cylinderhead

    Quote Originally Posted by Janiv View Post
    Hvang, you got still the head?? Priv message to me the stuff what you´ve got and tell some information of them please.

    -Jani
    Didn't want this post to get lost on the previous page.....

  3. #83
    Racer Decade Plus User RWD fords rule's Avatar

    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Ireland
    Age
    39
    Posts
    3,579
    Thanks
    173
    Thanked 374 Times in 312 Posts

    Re: Holbay Cylinderhead

    Quote Originally Posted by escortinadriver View Post
    Just in case anyone is interested, I have the flow figures from when my Holbay head flowed. As far as I am aware, it had not been messed with and is 'as per factory' The flow figures aren't that good TBH, and unfortunately all the cooling and RR gear was long gone.

    This is what I have for the Holbay head @10 inch (x1.58 for 25").

    inlet

    lift .05 .1 .15 .2 .25 .3 .35 .4 .45 .5
    17.8 34.7 52 70.5 84.4 90.8 96.1 100.6 105.3
    108.7

    Ex
    lift .05 .1 .15 .2 .25 .3 .35 .4 .45 .5
    13.6 27 39.7 48.9 57.9 66.3 71.8 75.2 75.2
    75.2



    Shaun


    Yes the old holbay roller pinto heads did not flow that well at all, I had one with all the roller rocker gear and their wildest PR62 race cam, 344 deg inlet and 314 deg exhaust, but only 13mm lift.
    The roller rocker setup was far too complicated and actually quite unreliable without a few modifications.
    The inlet ports were done pretty well but were polished which is not good, on the other hand the exhaust ports were very poor, the dog leg was not removed at all, hence the port did not flow well.
    The valves were very light with 7.15mm stems but the inlet has a large tulip shape which doesn't flow nearly as well as the penny on a stick vizard style valve.
    It was very easy to turn over the cam though as there was very little friction and it would jump from lobe to lobe while turning, that made it a little difficult to time the cam in.

    Another thing to not with that setup is that cam tower straps are not needed as the valve lift and valve acceleration is pretty poor, I believe there is no real advantage using the holbay roller rocker assembly as it is outdated and also massively over priced.

    Regards
    Jason

  4. #84
    Tyre Kicker

    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Finland
    Age
    31
    Posts
    5
    Thanks
    1
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Re: Holbay Cylinderhead

    Well, its so long time when i last was online.... Somebody got pictures of the whole motor?? Those would be nice to see too..

    -Jani

  5. #85
    Pole Position Decade Plus User
    Turbosport Administrator
    Miniliteman's Avatar

    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    the Netherlands
    Posts
    4,888
    Thanks
    38
    Thanked 611 Times in 558 Posts

    Re: Holbay Cylinderhead

    Some photos I saved form don't know where ...




  6. #86
    Tyre Kicker

    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Finland
    Age
    31
    Posts
    5
    Thanks
    1
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Re: Holbay Cylinderhead

    Thanks for the photos, would there be any head available?(not warrior)... I ment does enybody have heard there is some heads still available?

  7. #87
    Tyre Kicker

    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Bridgnorth
    Age
    37
    Posts
    4
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Re: Holbay Cylinderhead

    Dont know if any one is still interested
    Here are some pics of my dads engine. Apparently this is the only genuine one runing in England.

    Very unlikley to find another one of these heads. why are you so desperate to get one?







    Cheers Max

  8. #88
    Racer Decade Plus User DarthVader's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    South Africa
    Age
    53
    Posts
    3,354
    Thanks
    20
    Thanked 37 Times in 35 Posts

    Re: Holbay Cylinderhead

    Thats a lovely looking enginebay.

  9. #89
    Tyre Kicker

    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Lancs
    Posts
    10
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Re: Holbay Cylinderhead

    Thought I would resurrect this with my Barn Find!

    Click image for larger version Name:	DSCF4547smallb.jpg Views:	569 Size:	121.2 KB ID:	64367

  10. #90
    Pit Crew rwd2ltrfiesta's Avatar
    My Race Car
    My 1st Project
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    clacton essex
    Age
    41
    Posts
    1,731
    Thanks
    70
    Thanked 97 Times in 94 Posts

    Re: Holbay Cylinderhead

    Quote Originally Posted by Miniliteman View Post
    Some photos I saved form don't know where ...




    holy heck

  11. #91
    Mechanic hawk1903's Avatar
    My Race Car
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    istanbul
    Age
    56
    Posts
    956
    Thanks
    269
    Thanked 59 Times in 59 Posts

    Re: Holbay Cylinderhead

    Beautiful photos. It is a great pity that Connaught did not make the copy of the real Holbay head but instead make another head for the Pinto bottom end. Very unfortunately, Connaught could not yet get the FIA approval of their head for the historic rallying. I just wonder why could not they go to right direction and have the original Holbay head just reproduced and have the FIA approval. I am sure with today's technology and components, that head could produce very nice results.

  12. #92
    Tyre Kicker

    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    United Kingdom
    Posts
    2
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Re: Holbay Cylinderhead

    If the real item could be legaly made how much interest would there be I wonder ? Guess today a 'New' Holbay Pinto T.C. head would cost £10/15 000.00 GBP as its the only homl item.Anything else would not be legal.Who is first in the que ??

  13. #93
    Racer Decade Plus User RWD fords rule's Avatar

    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Ireland
    Age
    39
    Posts
    3,579
    Thanks
    173
    Thanked 374 Times in 312 Posts

    Re: Holbay Cylinderhead

    No one will spend that kind of money on an out of date head, BDA/BDG are the obvious choice when spending that kind of money on a historic engine and are lighter higher revving engines, I expect the old Holbay head could be updated with much better cams, some unique porting + larger valves and it would make decent power but the BD's are ready to go
    "Horsepower sells cars, torque wins races" - Enzo Ferrari

  14. #94
    Mechanic hawk1903's Avatar
    My Race Car
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    istanbul
    Age
    56
    Posts
    956
    Thanks
    269
    Thanked 59 Times in 59 Posts

    Re: Holbay Cylinderhead

    A new legal Holbay head should not cost 10-15 k. Pounds if it is reproduced. If it costs that much, nobody should be interested in my opinon since some company's BDA/BDG price is very competetive at 16.5 k complete engine ( probably less some ancillaries but still .. )
    However, if a legal Holbay headed Pinto can be built around 11-12 k pounds than it may be interesting for a legal Gr.2 car.
    On the other hand, especially in countries like Finland, many Pinto builders are able to build FIA legal 2.0 lt. Pinto engines with around 210 bhp and in some cases up to 220 bhp which is plenty for a 920-930 kg Mk1 Escort on gravel. So, eventhough the Pinto engined Escort can only be a Gr.2 car, it should never be neglected. Anyway, I still love the Pinto engine and there is so much to do to build and tune them with today's components.

  15. #95
    Mechanic snapper1's Avatar

    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Chelmsford
    Age
    67
    Posts
    668
    Thanks
    27
    Thanked 50 Times in 48 Posts

    Re: Holbay Cylinderhead

    With the Holbay head unlikelly to be available and earlier in the thread Cosworth head ruled out is it the fact that the rules are around what was available in South Africa?
    As Escourt did have a Lotus twin cam 1558 fitted and a 1700 BDB according to Wikipedea
    Would not the RS1800 be a better starting point?

  16. #96
    Tyre Kicker

    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    United Kingdom
    Posts
    2
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Re: Holbay Cylinderhead

    All your comments are true in one way or another.However !
    1/To reproduce the head from nothing is not a cheap job !
    2/ As stated it is the ONLY legal T.C. head for the Pinto.
    3/ Yes you now can get power equal to that it made 'in the day'.But how much could its 2013 version make ?
    Ifs ands or buts. BUT it could be done !

  17. #97
    Tyre Kicker

    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Sweden
    Age
    51
    Posts
    4
    Thanks
    1
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Re: Holbay Cylinderhead

    I would be interested
    Last edited by larsa; 26-12-2013 at 17:46.

  18. #98
    Tyre Kicker

    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Sweden
    Age
    51
    Posts
    4
    Thanks
    1
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Re: Holbay Cylinderhead

    Quote Originally Posted by I.K.Engineering View Post
    If anyone is still interested on this thread I have a complete set of origonal Warrior drawings / blueprints and the "technical manual" for there 16v heads.
    I would be interested in the drawings and manual.
    /Larsa
    hases@bredband.net

  19. #99
    Mechanic hawk1903's Avatar
    My Race Car
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    istanbul
    Age
    56
    Posts
    956
    Thanks
    269
    Thanked 59 Times in 59 Posts

    Re: Holbay Cylinderhead

    I would also be interested with the drawings and the blueprints.

    Kind Regards,

  20. #100
    Bodger Gyver's Avatar

    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Stockholm, Sweden
    Age
    35
    Posts
    141
    Thanks
    7
    Thanked 7 Times in 7 Posts

    Re: Holbay Cylinderhead

    I would definitely appreciate if i could get the drawings and so forth also.
    Thanks in advance.
    Email: davidjohansson@msn.com

  21. #101
    Tyre Kicker

    Join Date
    Aug 2015
    Location
    Buchrarest, Romania
    Age
    54
    Posts
    2
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Re: Holbay Cylinderhead

    I would also much appreciate this.
    gabriel.stanciu@outlook.com

  22. #102
    Racer Decade Plus User

    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Edinburgh
    Age
    46
    Posts
    3,641
    Thanks
    68
    Thanked 234 Times in 230 Posts

    Re: Holbay Cylinderhead

    Warrior heads are legal for historic rallying, contact Connaught Engines, they sell the kits.

  23. #103
    Racer Decade Plus User

    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Edinburgh
    Age
    46
    Posts
    3,641
    Thanks
    68
    Thanked 234 Times in 230 Posts

    Re: Holbay Cylinderhead

    If it rember right the heads are around £6k

    http://www.connaughtengines.co.uk/warrior.asp

  24. #104
    Mechanic

    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    United Kingdom
    Age
    64
    Posts
    483
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 33 Times in 32 Posts

    Re: Holbay Cylinderhead

    We run 2 of these in classic saloon racing, running a 2ltr on carbs in a mk1 & a 2.3 on jenvey in a mk2.
    Both have run faultless between builds. Mk2 did 3 seasons in europe and more , before a very sensibly priced freashen up.
    Mk1 did over 3 seasons before a small lick over( very little wear on all componants)
    The guys at Connaught are well worth a call if it's proper power you are after.

  25. #105
    Spanner Monkey
    My Race Car
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Germany
    Posts
    428
    Thanks
    2
    Thanked 37 Times in 36 Posts

    Re: Holbay Cylinderhead

    The Warrior Head isn´t FIA legal or can elsewhere show me a Homologation Paper with it. Also is the Holbay Head only for the MK1 as from 1976 the FIA Rules has changed.
    The FIA has deleted the 5/5V in 1976. I have a FIA Letter of it. So a FIA MK2 Grp.2 RS2000 can´t use 16V, Dry Sump, 5/6 Link Rear Axle, Rear Disc Brake, Panhard Rod, 5 ZF Gear Box.

  26. #106
    Mechanic hawk1903's Avatar
    My Race Car
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    istanbul
    Age
    56
    Posts
    956
    Thanks
    269
    Thanked 59 Times in 59 Posts

    Re: Holbay Cylinderhead

    Quote Originally Posted by Escort TC View Post
    The Warrior Head isn´t FIA legal or can elsewhere show me a Homologation Paper with it. Also is the Holbay Head only for the MK1 as from 1976 the FIA Rules has changed.
    The FIA has deleted the 5/5V in 1976. I have a FIA Letter of it. So a FIA MK2 Grp.2 RS2000 can´t use 16V, Dry Sump, 5/6 Link Rear Axle, Rear Disc Brake, Panhard Rod, 5 ZF Gear Box.
    Escort TC is absolutely right !!!
    FIA a 2.0 lt Pinto Mk2 Grp.2 has lots of limitations in comparison to a Grp.2 Mk1
    We will soon be completing our FIA Mk1 Grp.2 car.

  27. #107
    Racer Decade Plus User Forest_rallying's Avatar

    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Derbyshire
    Posts
    2,438
    Thanks
    92
    Thanked 393 Times in 348 Posts

    Re: Holbay Cylinderhead

    Warrrior heads were designed by a company in Altrincham on Atlantic St in the 1980s, we went to their premises to look at the first cylinder heads that they produced, thats long before Connaught or any one else claims to fame.
    The original Holbay cylinder Head from the 70s has no connection what so ever with the Warrior Head that is now allowed in Historic Rallying, there is a photo of it in Vizards Tuning Pintos Book.

  28. #108
    Mechanic hawk1903's Avatar
    My Race Car
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    istanbul
    Age
    56
    Posts
    956
    Thanks
    269
    Thanked 59 Times in 59 Posts

    Re: Holbay Cylinderhead

    It is a great pity that Connaught did not produce the correct Holbay head. I wonder what was the idea of that original company in Altricnham which produced the Warrior head instead of the Holbay head since they could not homologate it from 1980's on. Even though, the Connaught Warrior head is a nice product it could be just be successful product if it was a Holbay head but then probably the original Holbay head's moulds were not available.

  29. #109
    Racer Decade Plus User

    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Edinburgh
    Age
    46
    Posts
    3,641
    Thanks
    68
    Thanked 234 Times in 230 Posts

    Re: Holbay Cylinderhead

    Why?, the Warrior head is better.

  30. #110
    Mechanic hawk1903's Avatar
    My Race Car
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    istanbul
    Age
    56
    Posts
    956
    Thanks
    269
    Thanked 59 Times in 59 Posts

    Re: Holbay Cylinderhead

    Quote Originally Posted by Erikmex View Post
    Why?, the Warrior head is better.
    Certainly, the Warrior head is much better and said to be more reliable but it is not motorsport legal outside the UK. In other terms, it is not FIA legal for historic motorsport.

  31. #111
    Racer Decade Plus User

    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Edinburgh
    Age
    46
    Posts
    3,641
    Thanks
    68
    Thanked 234 Times in 230 Posts

    Re: Holbay Cylinderhead

    Hmm, I'm not so sure about that, I'm on good terms with Rob Mckinna who issues historic papers for rally and race cars, he also does FIA papers across Europe, I'll ask and cone back to you.

  32. #112
    Mechanic hawk1903's Avatar
    My Race Car
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    istanbul
    Age
    56
    Posts
    956
    Thanks
    269
    Thanked 59 Times in 59 Posts

    Re: Holbay Cylinderhead

    Quote Originally Posted by Erikmex View Post
    Hmm, I'm not so sure about that, I'm on good terms with Rob Mckinna who issues historic papers for rally and race cars, he also does FIA papers across Europe, I'll ask and cone back to you.
    I am pretty sure abou this. In fact, I have a brand new Connaught head set up which I have bought it many years ago, hoping that Connaught will get the FIA approval but I believe they were never able to get it. In some countries like UK, Belgium and may be few others, the head is legal but not for the FIA historic championship events.

    Would be great if you could investigate further.

    Regards,
    kerem

  33. #113
    Racer Decade Plus User

    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Edinburgh
    Age
    46
    Posts
    3,641
    Thanks
    68
    Thanked 234 Times in 230 Posts

    Re: Holbay Cylinderhead

    Yes you are correct I emailed my scrutineer this morning, fancy selling that head then??

  34. #114
    Spanner Monkey redhf's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    uk derbyshire
    Age
    58
    Posts
    479
    Thanks
    164
    Thanked 18 Times in 18 Posts

    Holbay Cylinderhead

    Gary How would this set up compare with a historic sherwood bdg at £ 25k In the uk historic series ? .

  35. #115
    Racer Decade Plus User

    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Edinburgh
    Age
    46
    Posts
    3,641
    Thanks
    68
    Thanked 234 Times in 230 Posts

    Re: Holbay Cylinderhead

    About 50lb/ft of torque more at lower rpm's.

  36. #116
    Mechanic hawk1903's Avatar
    My Race Car
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    istanbul
    Age
    56
    Posts
    956
    Thanks
    269
    Thanked 59 Times in 59 Posts

    Re: Holbay Cylinderhead

    Quote Originally Posted by Erikmex View Post
    Yes you are correct I emailed my scrutineer this morning, fancy selling that head then??
    Not really at the moment, I may end up building a fast road Mk1 one day since I like building Pinto based engines. However, if I decide to sell the full kit then I will certainly drop you a line. When I bought the head from Connaught I also had the conrod and the pistons )
    I believe there are not many people using this head in the British Historic rallying scene.
    Thank you very much for the interest.

  37. #117
    Racer Decade Plus User Forest_rallying's Avatar

    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Derbyshire
    Posts
    2,438
    Thanks
    92
    Thanked 393 Times in 348 Posts

    Re: Holbay Cylinderhead

    I can't for the life of me see how a Warrior cylinder head that was 't designed and manufactured until the late 80s can be legal for Historic Rallying in the UK in a Car that ceased production in 1980/81, why is n't the normally aspirated Cosworth Head allowed?
    The Automotive company that we visited in 1989 in Altrincham had a demonstrator engine in a Sierra, we never got to drive it because the engine had a thrown Rod, it was built on a std bottom end. From memory the power quoted was approx 215 bhp. A full spec 2.0 litre Rally engine was quoted to be 245 to 250 bhp and 170 lb ft torque.
    The full Cylinder head kit at the time was quoted at £2250. I foolishly went down the NA Cosworth route, which cost a hell of a lot more than the Warrior head kit. No one to my knowledge had used the Warrior head at that time in a competition Car, I would have been one of their Guinea Pigs.
    Last edited by Forest_rallying; 28-08-2015 at 20:52.

  38. The Following User Says Thank You to Forest_rallying For This Useful Post:


  39. #118
    Racer Decade Plus User

    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Belgium
    Age
    56
    Posts
    2,118
    Thanks
    7
    Thanked 197 Times in 169 Posts

    Re: Holbay Cylinderhead

    I was also surprised when Connaught told me it was not a copy of the Holbay roller version but the Warrior head they where building. Named Warrior / Holbay. Something that did not match in my head. Belgium has strange regulations. In some classes Warrior heads are allowed but only up to 2000cc. But I've see Cosworth 16V heads with a different named valve cover passing scrutineers.

    The first time I've seen a Warrior head in action was round 1986 - 1987 I think. An English man was competing a MK2 Escort with 2,3 ltr Pinto / Warrior block. This was the first time in my live I saw a real big atmo Pinto engine in action. No BDA that could match with the power and torque of this engine.

    All I remember about the car was the publicity "Popular Motors" and the fact it throw a conrod the same day and even bent the steering rack. There was an other very well build Pinto mid 90's. Fiesta MK3 rear wheel driven, 2,3 ltr Pinto / atmo Cosworth head driven by Mike Manning.

  40. #119
    Pole Position Decade Plus User
    Turbosport Administrator
    Miniliteman's Avatar

    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    the Netherlands
    Posts
    4,888
    Thanks
    38
    Thanked 611 Times in 558 Posts

    Re: Holbay Cylinderhead

    Dirk,

    did Mike Manning drive a green Fiesta in RallyCross?
    Believe this is his car; picture taken in 1993 (?) at the rallycross circuit in Maasmechelen.
    Remember that car was very fast.

    Second photo is from Marc van Loon's Mk2 Escort with a Warrior engine; he drives the car for demo's and on selected (non-FIA) events in Holland.

    Grtz, Leon.




  41. #120
    Racer Decade Plus User

    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Belgium
    Age
    56
    Posts
    2,118
    Thanks
    7
    Thanked 197 Times in 169 Posts

    Re: Holbay Cylinderhead

    Hi Leon,

    Yes, correct. He was always close to the service point of John Cross. They call him "Mad Mike". The way he was drifting the long right after the starting line say enough. Flat out sideways, all the time, specially when he had to attack. I was always happy when his missed the start !!!! He never gave up !!! No idea where this guy left. And his mechanics, creasy guys, they came for the fun and the beer.

    Real fast engine. And Webers !! Yes.

+ Reply to Thread

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts