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    problems

    Hi
    I think this is the right place for the topic.
    So I have a 1.3 xflow on my escort. It has:
    burton power stage 2 head
    Bcf2 camHigher cr pistons
    4-2-1 ashley
    electronic ignition
    weber 32/36 manual choke

    When it is cold it has some problems to start and it seems like the choke only does worst. then it idles very rough with the rpm bouncing between 900 and almost dying, when I engage the choke it dies. has it gets warmer the rpm tends to go higher at idle. And when i give it a little gas it takes a while before it does anything.
    What do you think of the carb? I think it probably it has the jets from the 1.6gt. what should I do?

    I know the cam is not degreed correctly, because when I assembled the engine I didnīt know it was needed. So that makes it even harder to idle properly. By the way what is the best and easiest way to deggre the cams with the engine in place?

    What do you think?

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    Re: problems

    Well without being obvious - jets from an engine 25% bigger ain't going to help running especially idle! Whilst cam timing can be done in situ, getting accurate perpendicular views of the degree wheel / pointer will be tricky. Of course you'll need an adjustable cam wheel, degree wheel, pointer, dial gauge and mag base helps, also the recommended cam setting from the grinder. It may be easier to pull the engine or definately get some assistance to double check what you are doing - two pairs of eyes better than one!

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    Re: problems

    Quote Originally Posted by katana View Post
    Well without being obvious - jets from an engine 25% bigger ain't going to help running especially idle! Whilst cam timing can be done in situ, getting accurate perpendicular views of the degree wheel / pointer will be tricky. Of course you'll need an adjustable cam wheel, degree wheel, pointer, dial gauge and mag base helps, also the recommended cam setting from the grinder. It may be easier to pull the engine or definately get some assistance to double check what you are doing - two pairs of eyes better than one!
    thanks for the opinion. The problem is that the only way for m to take the engine out is underneath the car, wich is not very easy because I have no lifter and it is all assembled. i can't take it upwards because i donīt have an engine crane. On the kent website it says the cam should be at full lift at 108š ATDC. but i read that the best value is 106š for this cam.

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    Re: problems

    Before you start "stripping". Measure both inlet and exhaust lift at TDC for the cylinder not in compression stroke. If there is little more lift for inlet as exhaust, leave it. You can't feel the difference between 108° and 106° anyway. Sometimes even difficult to measure on a dyno.

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    Re: problems

    Also, let me know the lift number at TDC, not common with KENT engines but if you use single 32/36 you will be best with very little lift at tdc.

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    Re: problems

    Quote Originally Posted by onyd View Post
    Before you start "stripping". Measure both inlet and exhaust lift at TDC for the cylinder not in compression stroke. If there is little more lift for inlet as exhaust, leave it. You can't feel the difference between 108° and 106° anyway. Sometimes even difficult to measure on a dyno.
    Quote Originally Posted by onyd View Post
    Also, let me know the lift number at TDC, not common with KENT engines but if you use single 32/36 you will be best with very little lift at tdc.
    thanks. Ok I will measure it out. The inlet lift at TDC stated is 2.18mm. But as I mentioned above, these values are not the optimal numbers, because it says that inlet full lift at 108 ATDC when the best is 106.

    I also took a look at my carb and I think the idle jets where swapped around. the 55 was on the primary and the 50 on the secondary barrel. I still didnīt had the time to mess around with the carb after that but it seamed to get a litle better.

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    Re: problems

    Idle jet's will have less effect on idle mixture. It's mainly the idle mix screw that set the idle fuel quantity. The jet wil have more influence when prog holes open. But with valve lift's like 2,18 mm your first progression hole is open and even if you would correct the carb will already suffer from to much lift at TDC.

    There is still running water over the manifold to head the inlet? Otherwise it can also be freezing.

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    Re: problems

    Quote Originally Posted by onyd View Post
    Idle jet's will have less effect on idle mixture. It's mainly the idle mix screw that set the idle fuel quantity. The jet wil have more influence when prog holes open. But with valve lift's like 2,18 mm your first progression hole is open and even if you would correct the carb will already suffer from to much lift at TDC.

    There is still running water over the manifold to head the inlet? Otherwise it can also be freezing.
    Thanks again. Could you repeat it in a simpler way? English isn't my native language and I didn't understood very well. What is a progression hole?
    About the Water I am pretty sure it is not freezing because i live in Algarve and it never gets near freezing temperatures.

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    Re: problems

    Prog holes are the small holes in your carb just at the point your throttle plate is when it is closed. They have to open at the right moment and supply the extra fuel before the main jet start and takes over.

    About the freezing, this is the biggest misunderstanding of all. It's not because you live I high temps it is not freezing. All depends how much water is collected in the air. In Belgium biggest issues with freezing are on hot day's with hight humidity (like 80%). This means day's water drops from your head without working. If you got these kind of days in Portugal you are in high risk of freezing. It's the water that start making drops in your inlet manifold. In California you don't have freezing and today, very cold in Belgium but no water in the air so no or almost no risk about freezing. High temps does help to stay out of freezing but it the % water that counts. In Miami it's also hot but with lot more water in the air compared to California, here there is a risk of freezing. No idea how it is in Portugal.

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    Re: problems

    Quote Originally Posted by onyd View Post
    Prog holes are the small holes in your carb just at the point your throttle plate is when it is closed. They have to open at the right moment and supply the extra fuel before the main jet start and takes over.

    About the freezing, this is the biggest misunderstanding of all. It's not because you live I high temps it is not freezing. All depends how much water is collected in the air. In Belgium biggest issues with freezing are on hot day's with hight humidity (like 80%). This means day's water drops from your head without working. If you got these kind of days in Portugal you are in high risk of freezing. It's the water that start making drops in your inlet manifold. In California you don't have freezing and today, very cold in Belgium but no water in the air so no or almost no risk about freezing. High temps does help to stay out of freezing but it the % water that counts. In Miami it's also hot but with lot more water in the air compared to California, here there is a risk of freezing. No idea how it is in Portugal.
    OK. Normally here the air here is very dry with litle humidity, like 20%. How does that afects the rought idle?

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    Re: problems

    Carmos, if possible fit a distributor with points and a suitable coil. That way you know the electronic ignition isn't the culprit.

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    Re: problems

    Than it should not be an issue, please note, it can be anything, like Leon say, check ignition for errors etc..

    Rough idle can also caused by the cam but your should have at least idle, not over rich and stalling. That's more like a tuning error

    Anyway, from my point of view, you start with a cam, not ideal for single carb setup.

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    Re: problems

    if the carb has an anti stall it may be the the low manifold vacuum caused by small cc and the cam has the anti stall pumping fuel in

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    Re: problems

    Quote Originally Posted by Graham View Post
    if the carb has an anti stall it may be the the low manifold vacuum caused by small cc and the cam has the anti stall pumping fuel in
    No it doesn't gás anti stall

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    Re: problems

    besides the idle that is always changing rpm up and down with the tendency to rise the idle, the engine shakes a lot, I've checked the engine mounts and they are ok. The timing is set with a strobe, and the guy I asked to do it for me told me he had to put it with a little bit more advance, otherwise it would run even worst.
    after a couple hours of not working it takes a while to start, normally only starting on the 3rd try. then the first seconds I have to keep my foot on the acelerator, otherwise it dies, and then after about 1 minute the idle goes to about 1k them it starts climbing until about 1700 rpm without me doing anything, Can it be that the rpm counter is malfunctioning? if I drop the idle screw it makes it even worst when it starts. what i find weird is that it doesnīt like the choke. Every time I engage the choke it starts working really bad and dies.

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    Re: problems

    Iīve checked the jets today I think they are a litle messed up so i have
    50/55 idle
    140/135Main
    160/165 air

    I am thinking in starting over with the std 1300gt jetting wich is:
    55/50 idle
    135/140 main
    180/180 air

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    Re: problems

    woah, slow down fella, your issues will not be anything to do with main jets or air correctors, so swapping jets will only complicate matters. you could have issues with air leaks, so with the engine running spray wd40 or similar around the base of the carb and inlet manifold gasket, if you have an air leak the way it runs will change when you find the leak. also look down the carb with the engine running at idle, if you see fuel dribbling out the aux vents either the carb is flooding ( float valve or float height problem) or the idle circuit has a problem and the throttle stop has been screwed a long way in to make it idle

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    Re: problems

    Quote Originally Posted by Graham View Post
    woah, slow down fella, your issues will not be anything to do with main jets or air correctors, so swapping jets will only complicate matters. you could have issues with air leaks, so with the engine running spray wd40 or similar around the base of the carb and inlet manifold gasket, if you have an air leak the way it runs will change when you find the leak. also look down the carb with the engine running at idle, if you see fuel dribbling out the aux vents either the carb is flooding ( float valve or float height problem) or the idle circuit has a problem and the throttle stop has been screwed a long way in to make it idle
    thanks. those aux vents are these right?
    that go in the midle of the barrels?
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails 1586-83.JPG‎  


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    Re: problems

    yes thats an aux vent

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    Re: problems

    Quote Originally Posted by Graham View Post
    yes thats an aux vent
    today I checked that but I didn't see any fuel there I even checked with a light.
    I think I have a very rich misture because the engine hesitates a lot and dies when choked just a bit. I checked the spark plugs and thy are very very black and wet. Puting the ignition timing to stated values makes the engine backfire trough the carb, I think that is because of the camshaft timing being bad, wich makes me set the ignition incorrectly making the engine work bad.

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    Re: problems

    it the rotor arm pointing on the correct stud on the distributor cap?

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    Re: problems

    Quote Originally Posted by daniele View Post
    it the rotor arm pointing on the correct stud on the distributor cap?
    yes. all the sparks are firing

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    Re: problems

    someone told me that with this cam (bcf2) I would never get it to idle bellow 1500/2000 rpm?!?!?
    is this true?

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    Re: problems

    on a properly set up pair of 40's this cam will idle nice and very smoothly at around 900 rpm or lower, but on a twinchoke it you should be able to get a reasonably smooth idle around 1000rpm

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    Re: problems

    Quote Originally Posted by Graham View Post
    on a properly set up pair of 40's this cam will idle nice and very smoothly at around 900 rpm or lower, but on a twinchoke it you should be able to get a reasonably smooth idle around 1000rpm
    At the time everybody that I speaked to told me that 40's would be far too big for my engine, so I went down the path of the 32/36.

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    Re: problems

    you didnt ask me! and i dont think you asked on this forum because bcf2 and 40's work really well together

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    Re: problems

    Quote Originally Posted by Graham View Post
    you didnt ask me! and i dont think you asked on this forum because bcf2 and 40's work really well together
    Yes your right. At that time i didn't know this fórum.

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    Re: problems

    Now I have cam degred correctly, and the ignitionj is set at 14š BTDC. When cold, the engine starts ok with the choke completly engaged, then as soon as it starts I have to disangage it otherwise it dies. On the first 5 to 10 minutes when it's still cold I have to keep constantly giving it a litle gas, otherwise the rpm drop a lot and it shuts down. During this period it does litle pops at the exhaus when giving it a litle throttle, I am not sure if it is backfiring, but I think so.

    Then the engine warms up and stops with the pops and it can hold idle at around 900-1200 rpm floating betwin that. On the road it doesn't respond very well. It seems like it lacks power. when acelerating a bit harder it takes a while before starting to go, like turbo lag.....

    Do you think it's to lean? On the IPO (portuguese MOT) the Co level was at 2.3% at idle, I expected to be around 6 or 7% for an engine of this spec.

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