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View Poll Results: SHOULD I RE MAKE ESCORT SHELLS, GENUINE INTERESTED PARTIES ONLY REPLY

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  • MK1 SHELLS

    118 41.70%
  • MK2 SHELLS

    128 45.23%
  • OWN VIN NO,

    7 2.47%
  • INTERESTED IN DEPOSIT SCHEME,,

    30 10.60%
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Thread: New shells,, yes or no??? Mk1 and mk2

  1. #41
    Bodger

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    Re: New shells,, yes or no??? Mk1 and mk2

    so far have huge confidence in the plant that i have chosen, cost i more than others but ihave seen their other shells, and th DO make for a big car nmanufacturer
    cost includes shipping, guys i have to get their final price,, so bear with me, if its not a goer panels will be anyway,
    thank to all here,,

    and fossie,, my thought and interpritation exactly on re making and china stuff,

  2. #42
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    Re: New shells,, yes or no??? Mk1 and mk2

    The idea of a complete new Mk1/2 shell is a great thought. But, given that Expressed Panels produce X% of replacement panels have you perhaps looked into the cost effectiveness of using Expressed Panels where possible, paying china to produce the missing Y% of panels and then paying for a jig to be made in the UK to fix them all together?

    If Expressed know about new shells being produced (and are we talking a strict 300 shell run or an unlimited number?) they may be willing to do a special price deal to ensure their components are in those shells as opposed to losing a certain percentage of their business through people purchasing complete shells elsewhere.

    I'm just jeleous as the cost to ship a new shell to Australia probably makes it uneconomical
    1970 Mk1 Escort Tarmac Rally Car

  3. #43
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    Re: New shells,, yes or no??? Mk1 and mk2

    Quote Originally Posted by MK1_Oz View Post
    I'm just jeleous as the cost to ship a new shell to Australia probably makes it uneconomical

    but if 1 falls off before it leaves china
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  4. #44
    World Champion Decade Plus User exboyracer's Avatar

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    Re: New shells,, yes or no??? Mk1 and mk2

    I very much doubt that ex-pressed have the capacity to cope with the volume of panels required for a run of shells, they are always running at 3-6 months lead time for new orders.
    http://escort.accelerator.org
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  5. #45
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    Re: New shells,, yes or no??? Mk1 and mk2

    good idea, i'd def be interested in getting one into oz

    edit: actually given that thats gonna be 8 to 10k aussie its kinda uneconomical as you can get a pretty decent car with a decent sheel for that here. Although definatly worth getting some made for the uk i recon, especially if you could get a large batch done and hold on to them for a few more years
    Last edited by MIK THE AUSSIE; 13-04-2010 at 07:29.

  6. #46
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    Re: New shells,, yes or no??? Mk1 and mk2

    ok guys had no net for a few days here, but back on,
    shells to oz from uk woud be a bit much, but we did the reverse, so its possible,
    just in airport, so cant hang about, next stop indonesia,, should have connection there

  7. #47
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    Re: New shells,, yes or no??? Mk1 and mk2

    very intersting thread this and I applaude you for atcually doing it, rather then just talk, I may be interested in the deposit scheme, I'll watch the thread with interest



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  9. #48
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    Re: New shells,, yes or no??? Mk1 and mk2

    The more i think about this the more excited i get and am interested in the deposit scheme, fingers crossed this will all come together, Frank.
    old fool Frank

  10. #49
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    Re: New shells,, yes or no??? Mk1 and mk2

    Quote Originally Posted by old skool racer View Post
    next stop indonesia,, should have connection there
    Big plane crash in Indo!!

    Careful!!

  11. #50
    Bodger

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    Re: New shells,, yes or no??? Mk1 and mk2

    got here, never heard of a crash,,
    will have a definate soon from the factory about price, so then if ok its all steam ahead,

  12. #51
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    Re: New shells,, yes or no??? Mk1 and mk2

    soon mk1/2 escorts will be on racks like this

  13. #52
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    Re: New shells,, yes or no??? Mk1 and mk2

    excellent thread, i´ve just read the whole thing without blinking i think i´m not really ready now but i will certainly be keeping this in mind and good luck, thank god for ppl with balls of steel.

  14. #53
    Way too much free time Decade Plus User Retromotorsport's Avatar
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    Re: New shells,, yes or no??? Mk1 and mk2

    I've been reading this ... and just my two-penneth.. a standard shell to which the type 49kits are added would be my choice, and probably save a few ringers, and keep costs down.
    As for adding arches and tubs, noooo.. please dont, because i would still be cutting them out and off depending if its a LWB or SWB car thats required or if it high arched or standard.
    I've mentioned this thread too a couple of people, and they asked me to keep them informed.

    As to the stupid Ford idea of copywrite infringement, i was lead to belive that Expressed had got a shell with no miles on it, they carefully pulled it apart and did have a press annoucement that they hoped to produce complete mk2 shells, then later heard that Ford had sent the Lawyers letters. ... maybe urban myth to explain Expressed's lack of confidence in sales..hence no shells,pricing a shell up using Expressed parts, from the screen forward is over 2.5k ... thats about a 1/4 of the car, and panels that need 'fitting' ... so a full shell 2.5k x4 = 10k, plus the building into a shell on top.

    I would be interested in your shells, personally i think the price mentioned is very good, and would aslo be interested in delete options .. ie the rear spring front hangers, front seat x-members, rear seat over tunnel brace, the rear damper brace, diff bump stop, axle bump stops, etc .. as i'd still be removing these.

    Your a brave man, and best of luck to you.

  15. #54
    Bodger

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    Re: New shells,, yes or no??? Mk1 and mk2

    thank you,, and yes no way was i gonna do the grp 4 thing as so many variations out there,
    and every builder has his own little tweaks,
    a basic shell without the type 49 bits,, yup why not, but for sure the 6 dial dash option,
    delete options, well in my shell pricing i have used existing seat and rad xmembers, rad support, under wing kits, slam panels and front and rear panel that are in existance already, plus or minus maybe one or two,,so maybe i can look into that,,,
    mk1 ind lamps complete are on the way now too, as the mk2 ones were a runaway success,,
    feck ford, when have they last produced anything for mk1 or 2,
    and there are many more newer panels bein made than our old obsolete escorts.

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  17. #55
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    Re: New shells,, yes or no??? Mk1 and mk2

    If Ford do start playing silly buggers, just sell the shells without a roof skin fitted and advertise as a very large repair section.

    Just another thing, are the shells going to come fully E-Coat primered as per a new car

  18. #56
    Bodger

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    Re: New shells,, yes or no??? Mk1 and mk2

    if i can do asemble there yes for sure, full e coat primer, but if has to be dome here i dunno wat the story will be,
    all will be revealed ,,
    and thank all,, for suggestions and support,

  19. #57
    Pole Position Decade Plus User morcheen's Avatar

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    Re: New shells,, yes or no??? Mk1 and mk2

    do you have to supply a mk1 and 2 shell for them to work off,and do you have shells available for them if and when you get the green light ?

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    Re: New shells,, yes or no??? Mk1 and mk2

    I think this is a good idea how long will it be before the rally and race boys have smashed all the mk1s and mk2s up if there isnt restrictions but on them which people dont want. I think most people restoring or building a early escort want a rs shell not a basic one and they should be in standard form i.e not arched or four linked,i have a mk2 rs custom being restored at the moment and even with the guy doing it at a good rate its still very costly . If repro shells are readerly available will this push the price of original shells up? And if i wanted to build a new car from new parts ( as most parts are available now) would i be able to register it as a new car? As i think even if all the escort nuts pulled out the log books out of the draw they've hidden away there still wouldnt be enough old registrations to go around.but like most people i would definatly be intersted in this. Will keep watching.

  21. #59
    Spanner Monkey

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    Re: New shells,, yes or no??? Mk1 and mk2

    If the assembly happens this side of the world, and you base it in the midlands, I know that GKN in Telford would only be charging about £150-200 per shell for a full e coat primer. We have some parts fully e coat primer at work for this price and there about the same size as a shell. Just some more information for you to digest.

  22. #60
    Bodger

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    Re: New shells,, yes or no??? Mk1 and mk2

    ok mac thanks a bunch, so it can be done,, thats great, the plants i chose out there dip the full final product like a conveyor belt system, quite a few tanks looks like washing the first 2 or 3 then paint and then they go thru some kind of washing booth again , then dried,
    it all hinges on a few finer details now,
    yes morcheen i need supply 2 perfect unmarked shells, that in itself will be hard enough task, .. in a few yrs it will be impossible,

  23. #61
    Spanner Monkey

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    Re: New shells,, yes or no??? Mk1 and mk2

    With a potential million pound investment at stake this is in a whole different league to your wing project.
    I personally don't think taking 300+ peoples deposits is the best way to fund that investment. You will have all those people to answer to and it will be an admin nightmare.
    What if thinks start to go wrong , and more money is needed? What guarentee is there deposits are safe? What legal comeback with the deposit givers have etc etc.

    Its a tall order to ask the average Joe to risk that sort of money without even seeing then end product.

    If you want to go do that route you have to give people confidence to invest.
    To do that I think you need a more professional approach , ie form a company with a proper business plan, get a few main backers / investers and then come to the market showing you mean business.

    Good luck with the project and I hope you do manage to pull it off.

  24. #62
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    Re: New shells,, yes or no??? Mk1 and mk2

    That’s the same sort of process at the GKN plant. They where going on the same track as chassis parts being made for Land Rover. We also had www.surfaceprocessing.co.uk in Dudley quote us, but they where about £100 more. So there are quote a few places around that it can be done over here.

    Plus another thing to consider, a lot of the rally boys will be happier to have the shell not painted, which would only really be an option if there are assembled in the UK.

    If you are looking at the UK assembly route, try http://cpp-uk.com. My place is working with them at the moment, and they know there stuff.

  25. #63
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    Re: New shells,, yes or no??? Mk1 and mk2

    a1 top dog.
    thanks ,,,but to answer you post,,
    you couldn get more average than me, i dont even own a house,
    but i invested everthing i could into the wings grilles lamps etc, and now i see this can work,
    maybe not to everyones liking, but there are people out there who know the risks and are willing to take them,
    if i go ahead with this it will be only when i am sure it can be done,, this thread is to see if there is interest and who is interested.
    to answer if i mean business????? where did the other parts come from,, it wasnt a small investment either,,
    but i do business my way,, and my way only,, involving others means for sure higher pricing and outside interference,
    its a big investment yes, but easily self funding once it starts rolling.. just needs a few brave men,,
    its not without risk, but then neither is a good track day with your pride and joy. or for that matter any daily road trip.
    i understand its not going to be to everyones taste, but once the shells begin to come i can see many people with a different view,
    i seen what they make and i know they can do it, im offering this as a cheap way to a new shell,, those that come in after will pay a different price,
    the initial investors will get a co op kind of deal, if it doesnt happen it doesnt happen,, no worries, i will still make doors, rear quarters, whatever,

  26. #64
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    Re: New shells,, yes or no??? Mk1 and mk2

    John, have joined this forum in order to follow what you are proposing and wish you all the luck in following this through. What is best way to keep in touch with you as things hopefully move forward? Keith R
    Last edited by keithr; 19-04-2010 at 13:52.

  27. #65
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    Re: New shells,, yes or no??? Mk1 and mk2

    Hi,
    been on the forum for a while look for information and would definitely be interested in putting a deposit up. Keep me posted.

    Levi

  28. #66
    Bodger

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    Re: New shells,, yes or no??? Mk1 and mk2

    will be home 3rd may finally,, not that theres anythin wrong with a few weeks in the sun, in the philippines, but i have intermittent internet access here, will get down to work as soonn as i get home.
    by the way located my wings which were a little bit lost due to bein held up cuz of the ash cloud, they should get home as soon as i do,

  29. #67
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    Re: New shells,, yes or no??? Mk1 and mk2

    Any updates on the shells ?


    Cheers,
    David

  30. #68
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    Re: New shells,, yes or no??? Mk1 and mk2

    i personally think there is a fair amount of money to be made here, just think of how many motorsport people would purchase the shells. and if they are made properly, people will buy them instead of spending silly amounts of money and time prepping and restoring old rust buckets. If you had a brand new shell, all you would need to do is get it painted, then start bolting the shiny bits on. Bit like a Airfix kit

  31. #69
    Bodger

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    Re: New shells,, yes or no??? Mk1 and mk2

    update, still in the pricing process, and trying to guage interest,
    seems the mk 2 is the overall priority, but then its also the rally boys who have expressed the keenest interest and willingness to go for it..
    as it stands if it goes ahead, it looks like there will be no issiues with crash test, or type approval, as it is classed as a part and not a car,
    lots to do and learn yet,

  32. #70
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    Re: New shells,, yes or no??? Mk1 and mk2

    Best of luck - if you can pull it off, it will be a big achievement with big rewards.
    "TEA! FIVE SUGARS."

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    Re: New shells,, yes or no??? Mk1 and mk2

    Like to see how this works out.........."might" be interested in the Deposit Scheme if it's heading in the right direction.

    Please keep me in the loop.

  34. #72

    Re: New shells,, yes or no??? Mk1 and mk2

    I have a mk2 and 2 mk1's that I am trying to re-build. I would be interested in time to buy one but dont have the cash at the moment. I assume you will be continuing to have them made in batches if this does work?

    And as for types of shell - if you are reshelling a rustbucket or bent twisted wreck then you can cut out the bits you need to make the new shell match what you want. If your building from a kit of bits and a bit of paper (log book and spare parts) then does it really matter? You will only be doing a reshell in the same way as you would in period with a ford service shell! late type 49 HD mk1 shell and pre77 HD mk2 for me.

  35. #73
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    Re: New shells,, yes or no??? Mk1 and mk2

    in a way i think it would be daft to bulid the shell exactly the same as an original as you would have to fit a shitty solid axle on leaf springs, or modify the brand new shell which seems a bit of a waste. in my opinion it wold be better to build it to either take coil overs and a 4/5 link setp or whatever, or prefferably a full IRS rear axle off something like a bmw 3 series, nissan 200sx, mazda mx5 or something.

    but obviously you have to go with only one shell to suit most people's needs.

    i would be in for 1k deposit for a 4k shell, and wouldn't care if it's mk1 or mk2

  36. #74
    Mechanic windy's Avatar

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    Re: New shells,, yes or no??? Mk1 and mk2

    Might be worth a call to the eligibility scritineer Paul Loveridge Mob: 07831656472 to tell him about your plan. Providing the shell is made to the exact period standard specification, i.e. the same thickness of steel & dimensionally identical i don't see a problem with him allowing cars to be re-built with new shells.
    He is already allowing the new remanufactured ZF gearbox to be used in escorts because ZF no longer make them. They retail for around £5500 + VAT so if they are justifying producing them there has to be demand. Same would go for shells I would presume.
    I think your best bet is to speak to some of the high profile rally boys, people like Steve Perez, Malcolm Wilson, Mark Solloway etc who could source the financial backing you need to get the tooling financed. Relying on individuals financing this for you in large numbers by way of deposits, not knowing who you are of what your track record is, is quite a bit to ask I think.
    I would also suggest you get some legal people to research the Ford copyright bit before you start - I see this as being the stumbling block for the project. If you can overcome this then you will be well on the way.

  37. #75
    Way too much free time Decade Plus User Retromotorsport's Avatar
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    Re: New shells,, yes or no??? Mk1 and mk2

    Quote Originally Posted by ForeigneRS View Post
    in a way i think it would be daft to bulid the shell exactly the same as an original as you would have to fit a shitty solid axle on leaf springs, or modify the brand new shell which seems a bit of a waste. in my opinion it wold be better to build it to either take coil overs and a 4/5 link setp or whatever, or prefferably a full IRS rear axle off something like a bmw 3 series, nissan 200sx, mazda mx5 or something.

    but obviously you have to go with only one shell to suit most people's needs.

    i would be in for 1k deposit for a 4k shell, and wouldn't care if it's mk1 or mk2
    If you went your route you've just lost probably 75% or more of sales.

    Heritage sell a lot of shells because they are direct replacements. They dont put upgrades in them because a lot of buyers want an 'original' car.

    If you look at a showground, the ammount of unmodfied shells far out number the linked cars, and you'll be lucky to see an IRS one.

    Most cars out there are unarched and anti-tramped.. and sticking some anti-tramp brackets on isnt hard or expensive when you have a new shell.. taking the bloody things off however is a pain = £££'s
    If the shells are turetted, i'd be cutting those out..again adding ££'s to a build .. same with 4links, if they are Gp4 copies, then they are designed for a shell using 13" wheels and at standard ride height. so they would need cutting out too. as thats no good for a car running 15/16" wheels with a low ride height.

    I think most prep companies would prefer a standard shell.

    Personally, i wouldnt buy a shell thats been Group 4'ed ... a few rally boys may, but each company has its own tweeks to the theme.

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  39. #76
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    Re: New shells,, yes or no??? Mk1 and mk2

    Your average Escort fan isn't going to be looking for rally spec shells, but they are looking for rot free or new shells to transplant parts into. Besides, those who want uprated shells will no doubt know how to do it themselves, and having it already done is taking the fun out of it.
    "TEA! FIVE SUGARS."

  40. #77
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    Re: New shells,, yes or no??? Mk1 and mk2

    add me to the list of possibles




  41. #78
    Pole Position Decade Plus User morcheen's Avatar

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    Re: New shells,, yes or no??? Mk1 and mk2

    heard on the radio that the usa want china to sort out their cheap manufacturing and bring it into line with everyone else,this might push up costs now.i'm sure OSR mentioned the cheap rates were not going to be about forever.

  42. #79
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    Re: New shells,, yes or no??? Mk1 and mk2

    sure the usa might want that, so there manufacturing industry has less competition, but i cant see china taking any notice

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    Re: New shells,, yes or no??? Mk1 and mk2

    Just like the polution

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