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Thread: ST170 into MK2 Escort - pan question

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    ST170 into MK2 Escort - pan question

    I´m installing ST170 engine into MK2 Escort and beacuse of the space between x-member and pan I want to change the frame between the block and the pan for Mondeo (2.0 Zetec-E), part No. 1098757. Are these parts interchangeable? Steel pan I´ll modify, same as the suction basket... On ST170 is the frame sloping, on Mondeo is straight and I hope is overall lower. Am I right?
    Thanks for advice.

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    World Champion Decade Plus User alladdin's Avatar

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    Re: ST170 into MK2 Escort - pan question

    theres not enough room over the escort x member to use a std cradle / frame and modified lower steel pan.

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    Re: ST170 into MK2 Escort - pan question

    Yes, thats why I' m asking, if will help cradle from Mondeo and modified pan or what cradle to use. Mondeo looks straight at parts catalogue...

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    Re: ST170 into MK2 Escort - pan question

    My engine was from a Mondeo Zetec B/Top and had the sloped cradle and steel pan - I looked at milling the cradle flat and plating it to retain the bottom end stiffness but to clear the x-member there wouldn't have been much left so I abandoned the idea and just used a RF aluminium sump and even that is pretty close ! ! !

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    World Champion Decade Plus User alladdin's Avatar

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    Re: ST170 into MK2 Escort - pan question

    Quote Originally Posted by motorpoint View Post
    Yes, thats why I' m asking, if will help cradle from Mondeo and modified pan or what cradle to use. Mondeo looks straight at parts catalogue...
    as above if its for a rwd escort you need a rwd sump. either modify 1800 cvh or purchase retro ford, g19 , neil dunne etc

    you dont need cradle, bin it as sump goes onto block direct

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    Re: ST170 into MK2 Escort - pan question

    katana / alladdin: thanks for your advices. I´m still thinking about cutting the original cradle, using the top and bottom and weld it together and that maybe I can use modified sump. Or do you think is better to go with sump directly onto the block?

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    Re: ST170 into MK2 Escort - pan question

    ...and one more question. If I´ll go with sump directly onto the block, the bellhousing and the engine will be on 5 screws only (3 on the left, 2 on the right). Is it enough?

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    Re: ST170 into MK2 Escort - pan question

    Its plenty - some American V8's only have half a bellhousing attached to the block as the bottom half is completely missing. http://www.atiracing.com/products/trans/350/350-350.jpg
    Its the width across the bolted sections that counts.

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    Re: ST170 into MK2 Escort - pan question

    i suppose if you cut a section from cradle it may work but if you can alloy weld just do an escort fwd sump ? the cut down cradle including the pan attached must be around 50mm total in front of rear bowl to clear x member. i cant remember exact size , just check a pinto sump etc ( or cvh 1800 as thats minimal clearance internal - touches oil pump)

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    Re: ST170 into MK2 Escort - pan question

    katana: Nice picture. Although I'm an engineer, I've had a problem all my life with oversizing everything :-) That's why I'd rather have 10 screws around :-) M20 at least :-)

    alladdin: I will proceed by cutting the lower part about 5 mm below the pump tube and make a sump in the back so that the gap is about 20 mm behind the x-member. I choose the same depth as for the original , I just add the wings to the sides to keep the volume of oil. I just don't know how to solve the oil splash when the crankshaft is submerged in it. If I have to make some buffle there for ex. 10mm above bottom...
    But maybe the second option is better. Use a Sierra 1.8 tin tub without a cradle. It will be better cut and welded and if I fuck it, I will buy a new one for a few € ...
    Last edited by motorpoint; 23-02-2021 at 22:20.

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    Re: ST170 into MK2 Escort - pan question

    Quote Originally Posted by motorpoint View Post
    katana: Nice picture. Although I'm an engineer, I've had a problem all my life with oversizing everything :-) That's why I'd rather have 10 screws around :-) M20 at least :-)

    But maybe the second option is better. Use a Sierra 1.8 tin tub without a cradle. It will be better cut and welded and if I fuck it, I will buy a new one for a few € ...
    Correct me if i'm wrong but wasn't the RS alloy sump the only one under a Pinto that also bolted to the gearbox? Anything with a front bowl / tin sump would have had nothing to fix into anyway?

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    Re: ST170 into MK2 Escort - pan question

    Quote Originally Posted by katana View Post
    Correct me if i'm wrong but wasn't the RS alloy sump the only one under a Pinto that also bolted to the gearbox? Anything with a front bowl / tin sump would have had nothing to fix into anyway?
    I recall something on the lines of some MK3 Cortinas having a support strut from the bottom of the bellhousing bolted to the side of the engine block, I can't remember if that was on both sides or not.

    On a Car competing on rough stage events there's a good chance that an alloy bellhousing could crack due to fatigue where it bolts to the gearbox, I have seen quite a few like that. Having said that I have used the said bellhousings where there's been no support, only the std 6 bolts fixing it to the block and I have never had one crack.

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    Re: ST170 into MK2 Escort - pan question

    Quote Originally Posted by Forest_rallying View Post
    I recall something on the lines of some MK3 Cortinas having a support strut from the bottom of the bellhousing bolted to the side of the engine block, I can't remember if that was on both sides or not.

    On a Car competing on rough stage events there's a good chance that an alloy bellhousing could crack due to fatigue where it bolts to the gearbox, I have seen quite a few like that. Having said that I have used the said bellhousings where there's been no support, only the std 6 bolts fixing it to the block and I have never had one crack.
    you correct, they had a steel strap on one side - some engines (xf ?) v. early maybe, had a bracket on tin sump.
    but none can be needed as no one ever re fits them

    theres a page on net somewhere where a guy gives some dimension drawings for rwd zetec sump - paul ?? tiuger cat ??? its a kit build have a google

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    Re: ST170 into MK2 Escort - pan question

    It is possible to use a focus pan I milled the angle off and left the windage tray with a plate welded to the face.
    I then made my oil pan and pick up pipe to suit, it has the pick up area and the wing baffled I then drilled and tapped for my bolts.
    It fits my engine bay as a rear sump because I am using a shortened miata rack and column.
    Sorry they are not the best pictures but it shows it can be done.
    I just have to make my gasket to make then it goes in again.


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    Re: ST170 into MK2 Escort - pan question

    105e gary: Yes, this is the way I will go. I milled the bottom into the plane. Just now I don't know if I should make the pan screw-like, like you have, or weld it directly to the milled part.

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    Re: ST170 into MK2 Escort - pan question

    Copper tube 18mm, soldered with silver. Final step will be to weld the bottom of the pan ...

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    Re: ST170 into MK2 Escort - pan question

    Actual sump capacity doesn't seem that much? My RF sump well is about 150mm deep below the flat bottom portion.

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    Re: ST170 into MK2 Escort - pan question

    well, if crankshaft and rods (the lowest point) are cca 10mm above the oil level capacity is calculated 4.56lt. do you think it is not enough? original capacity is 4.75 (4.25 + 0.5 filter). or do you think the oil level it too close to crankshaft and rods?

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    Re: ST170 into MK2 Escort - pan question

    I was just figuring std. oil level must be below the std cast windage section that is now removed so I was discounting any of the flat section? Surprised on std. oil capacity being that much - the RF one is 3.5lts!

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    Re: ST170 into MK2 Escort - pan question

    Maybe I'll make some dividing plate out of aluminum sheet between the pan and the crank due to oil splash.
    Last edited by motorpoint; 20-08-2021 at 10:13.

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