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Thread: Xflow AX Block price value?

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    Spanner Monkey

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    Xflow AX Block price value?

    Hello,

    How much is worth an AX engine with 20 000 mile on the clock, standard 1600cc bores and complete ( with cranck etc)?
    is it worth 1800 euros?

    Now I don't understand the story of : "An AX block has thicker walls than a 711M and thus allow to be bored over 1700cc safely".

    if the external walls of the engine can be thicker for an AX block, as the cranckshaft is the same, it means the distance between cylinders are the same... So if you bore a 711M or if you bore an AX you have the same chances to go through a water jacket in between two cylinders, right?

    Can someone explain me what I don't understand?

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    Re: Xflow AX Block price value?

    NO,

    its not the external walls of the block that are thicker, its the wall of the cylinders below the top face of the block which are thicker

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    Pole Position Decade Plus User Pushrod King's Avatar
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    Re: Xflow AX Block price value?

    The AX block is the best option for big bore engines (over 83.5mm) because as Graham said the cylinder walls are thicker, they are also very rare which makes them expensive.

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    Formerly harrier mk2 Decade Plus User Fridgeman's Avatar

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    Re: Xflow AX Block price value?

    there not 1800 euro though . andy oldskoolrules on here has or had one for about 1000 euro [rough calc]. and that seems to be about the going rate.but that is just the block or short engine.
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    Re: Xflow AX Block price value?

    so I presume nothing has been sent to Milan?
    just for fun, today I fixed an english ford focus with french licence plate!
    nothing special, but classical Zetec's defects
    coil
    sparkplugs leads
    tee breather hoses
    all together!

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    Re: Xflow AX Block price value?

    Engine builder Dave Brooks in Crewe measured several standard 711m blocks and several AX blocks for bore wall thickness. Absolutely NO DIFFERENCE! Don't waste your money - it's a myth. And if anyone wants to argue the toss - argue with Dave Brooks not me.. I know of many people who've bored their AX block to 86mm only to break through into into an oilway, and then having to fit liners.

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    Pole Position Decade Plus User Pushrod King's Avatar
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    Re: Xflow AX Block price value?

    Quote Originally Posted by MemphisTwin View Post
    Engine builder Dave Brooks in Crewe measured several standard 711m blocks and several AX blocks for bore wall thickness. Absolutely NO DIFFERENCE! Don't waste your money - it's a myth. And if anyone wants to argue the toss - argue with Dave Brooks not me.. I know of many people who've bored their AX block to 86mm only to break through into into an oilway, and then having to fit liners.
    Think you're confused with T numbers! Generally AX blocks have thicker bore walls (I've had one at 87mm) they also weigh more than 711ms.

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    Re: Xflow AX Block price value?

    Quote Originally Posted by Pushrod King View Post
    Think you're confused with T numbers! Generally AX blocks have thicker bore walls (I've had one at 87mm) they also weigh more than 711ms.
    No, I'm not confusing it with T numbers - I was at Dave Brooks' collecting xflow engine parts and had a long conversation with him, as I was thinking of building a large capacity xflow.

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    Re: Xflow AX Block price value?

    I had an AX block at 85.75mm and it was fine and had been running at that size.

    The bore walls were the same outside diameter but the block weighed 4 kilos more than a standard size 711m block.

    My feeling is that the blocks are made of a stronger material than the english xflow blocks.

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    Re: Xflow AX Block price value?

    It would be interesting to compare ax versus 711m versus the new blocks re edition

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    Spanner Monkey Mkdu's Avatar

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    Re: Xflow AX Block price value?

    You're right Cedric, interresting to see if this is not a better idea to buy a new bloc rather something 30 years old !
    You're talking about the complete engine on leboncoin ?
    Frenchies are always try to sell at a very high price, this guy has also a escort gearbox (not Rs) at 500€ !
    I've seen pinto engine to rebuild at 1000€ in France. In Belgium prices are high but not as our neighbours.
    That's why i bought my 2 last xflow engines in UK

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    Re: Xflow AX Block price value?

    i just sold my ax block and caps for £600, bare blocks seem to go between £500 and £800.

    another reason they are expensive is because the formula ford boys like them, even tho they only run standard bore they like the extra strength in the blocks, although i have known them to go back to 711 blocks to save weight!!!! sounds like it could be easier to have a few less pies before race day

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    Re: Xflow AX Block price value?

    interesting discussion, but surely its not applicable to a sensible fast road x/f?

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    Re: Xflow AX Block price value?

    Yes not a bare block but a complete engine on the french leboncoin.

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    Re: Xflow AX Block price value?

    I have a diesel X/flow with also 831C but no AX on the block, I wonder how far they can be bored out ?

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    Re: Xflow AX Block price value?

    Quote Originally Posted by racing escort View Post
    I have a diesel X/flow with also 831C but no AX on the block, I wonder how far they can be bored out ?
    seem to remember oilburner xflows being used in boats. I bought a formula ford complete xflow, dry sump etc etc for around the 400 quid mark and that had an ax block though it wasn't advertised as having one but i spotted the large dial marking on the block. Busted up the engine advertised the parts as from formula ford and made what i laid out on the standard stuff. Cleaned up the block and caps and a coat of go faster blue and collected £900 for it, mind you this was before the remanufactured ones appeared. Had a standard block here at the time to and there was a large difference in weight between the ax and 711 other than than didn't really compare the bore walls
    Last edited by GB; 02-11-2013 at 21:08.

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    Re: Xflow AX Block price value?

    One day I will strip the diesel xflow and compare them.

    Indeed, they come from boats. But rumour goes they also were in forklifts, generators, lawnmowers, brushing machines etc ... sadly nowadays they all got shredded since they were built in the 70's and maybe 80's !

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    Re: Xflow AX Block price value?

    Had this discussion before on TS - Had AX and 831C blocks go to 85mm, had some go threw at 84mm, luck of the draw. Corrosion's a bitch, I'd just sleave a 711 block.
    But at the current exchange rate it would be rather profitable for me to ship from South Africa to UK

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    Re: Xflow AX Block price value?

    Quote Originally Posted by DarthVader View Post
    Had this discussion before on TS - Had AX and 831C blocks go to 85mm, had some go threw at 84mm, luck of the draw. Corrosion's a bitch, I'd just sleave a 711 block.
    But at the current exchange rate it would be rather profitable for me to ship from South Africa to UK
    really is down to luck. we had a 711m bored once to 86.5 no sleeves, was only raced once though so don't know if it would have collapsed or not.
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    Re: Xflow AX Block price value?

    Quote Originally Posted by DarthVader View Post
    Corrosion's a bitch, I'd just sleave a 711 block.
    what he said!

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    Re: Xflow AX Block price value?

    There's an AX block and also another AX/complete engine for sale for an idea on what people are selling for ; http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Crossflow-...88?pt=UK_CarsP

    http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/FORD-CROSS..._CarParts_SM&h

    I've also had a couple of AX blocks/ engines - 831c was early casting and AX late as I understand it...

    The xflow diesel engine was named the "watermota sea panther" (eg look on youtube) and was based on the 1600cc kent petrol engine converted by a company called Watermota ltd. with the help from Exeter university and Ford between the late 1960s till the early 1980s I believe.

    Re Old blocks all will have age related issues they will need thorough cleaning and ultrasonic crack testing before you waist your time & money, block numbers dont mean much IMHO because of there age and previous useage. You could build a long stroke 711m without stressing the block by over boring it to keep away from the oil and water ways so if your wanting that sort of low down torque delivery do that but it all depends on other things as we know weight of car grip gearing track class rules regs and all that - if your racing and want revs you might be better with a short stroke screamer instead - if its just road use no need to spend loads on power as you wont need it all the time and of course there are other engines you could use of a more modern variety with refined characteristics that are more cost effective possibly even less than just an AX block, but of course it comes down to whats affordable with the budget you have and if you like to keep it as per original, horses for courses.
    Last edited by ProSkool; 16-11-2013 at 02:12.

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    Re: Xflow AX Block price value?

    apologies for posting on somebody's thread, i dont know how to start one. Good day, could somebody help me identify this block. 801C-6015-B35. its a south african block but i got no info on it and thought it could be as tough as the ax block.

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    Re: Xflow AX Block price value?

    I think this would have been out of the Sierra 1.6.

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    Re: Xflow AX Block price value?

    since Ford started to cast new 711 blocks, the ax-myth has started to crack.

    the new 711m is in reality an ax-block with 711 casting number (to satisfy the formula ford guys)

    so why should somebody pay "extra" money for something which is again availale new?

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    Spanner Monkey Mkdu's Avatar

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    Re: Xflow AX Block price value?

    I've heard from a engine builder that new block are crap.

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    Re: Xflow AX Block price value?

    Crap value considering you can get duratec crate engines for not much more. Just liner a standard block

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