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Thread: What do the most powerful 2.8 based v6 12v Colognes make in the world?

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    What do the most powerful 2.8 based v6 12v Colognes make in the world?

    As title really.

    Only seems like a handful ever made it past 300bhp.

    cheers

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    Re: What do the most powerful 2.8 based v6 12v Colognes make in the world?

    With the std head with siamesed ports you need a miracle or 2 to get 200 bhp!

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    Re: What do the most powerful 2.8 based v6 12v Colognes make in the world?

    agreed, without forced induction it rare to hear of anything over 200, 300bhp is just dreaming

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    Re: What do the most powerful 2.8 based v6 12v Colognes make in the world?

    I assumed they would be boosted.

    A guy bought a car off me once who had a N/A 2.8 bored & stroked to 3.7 with about 5 - 6 years of tuning work done on it & he said they just couldn't get it to make more than 270bhp.
    It used to be a sprint car.

    I know they are an unreliable engine when pushed.

    Used to have a 2.8 XR4x4 single turbo that pulled 13.1 quarters.
    The most unreliable car I ever owned. lol
    Last edited by DAVE323; 16-04-2016 at 22:39.

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    I have boosted version, evo1 engine gave 430hp and 570nm with 1bar of boost and e85 as a fuel. New evo2 Is now working and soon i Will hit To the dyno to see the results with 1-1.3bar of boost.

    -Antti

    Lähetetty minun D6503 laitteesta Tapatalkilla

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    Re: What do the most powerful 2.8 based v6 12v Colognes make in the world?

    430bhp is a very impressive figure but only 570 nm? do you mean ft/lbs ?????

    What was the spec.

    The new engine sounds promising.


    There was a guy in Argentina with a Twin Turbo EFI that I gave a bit of advice too that should have got good results but I lost touch.

    Is he on here?

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    Re: What do the most powerful 2.8 based v6 12v Colognes make in the world?

    No, 570nm is correct. Here is the graph from the run
    http://sultzi.kuvat.fi/kuvat/Ford+Co...PG/_medium.jpg

    Old engine had only 7.3:1 compression due my calculation error! And when I was building that engine plan was to use normal fuel (98) and calculated cr to be around 8.3:1 (which wasn't true after I did tear down the evo1 engine after broke down). Ported head, bigger valves, custom grind turbo camshaft, 2x garrett gt2860r (smallest ones, 310hp per turbo, with .64ar turbine housing). std 2.8l efi intake manifold.

    New engine has around 10:1 compression, e85, more aggressive cam (grinded to suit better turbo use), roller rockers with 1.6 ratio, e85 as a fuel too again. Turbo's were the same last year when we did mild dynotuning with this, had problems with hall sensor so rpm stopped at 5500rpm. Dyno plot to 5500rpm and 0,8bars from wheels, around 375hp at the crank.
    http://sultzi.kuvat.fi/kuvat/Ford+Co...PG/_medium.jpg

    Now I have fixed the rpm problem, changed little bit bigger turbos -> gt2860rs discopotato (with .86 ar turbine). So will be heading to the dyno soon to be tuned from the top too (7000rpm redline). Will let you know the results..
    Last edited by Sultzi; 17-04-2016 at 09:41.

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    Re: What do the most powerful 2.8 based v6 12v Colognes make in the world?

    Oh, here was one Capri racing with 2.6l cologne (now changed to 2.8l chevy v6). He had shy of 200whp in that engine.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1YUNLtHsbW0

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    Re: What do the most powerful 2.8 based v6 12v Colognes make in the world?

    Double post
    Last edited by Sultzi; 17-04-2016 at 10:01.

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    Re: What do the most powerful 2.8 based v6 12v Colognes make in the world?

    I think I have found the person with the highest BHP figures for a 2.8 Cologne in the world Sultzi.

    You have gone for very big turbo's for the engine which explains my confusion.
    I am used to seeing big torque figures for these v6's not BHP. Your tuning for high rev power.

    I have not worked on a 2.8 engine for over 15 years, back then there was nothing much over 300bhp but you are a good 100bhp or so up on them dinosaurs. Very impressive.

    How do you deal with the heat from the joined exhaust ports?
    Was a huge problem back then & I remember some engines cracking heads almost every other month.

    I myself stopped working on them for that very reason, the 6 port U.S heads never flowed as well as the euro heads so it was a big problem.

    Me myself is an old school tuner, don't use E85 but only low (95) octane fuel.
    I keep to low compression engines & keep things as simple as possible so no water injection etc.
    Just good old fashioned tuning.

    I have a 2.9 12v Cologne that makes 500 ft/lbs & 450bhp.


    The reason I am looking for high powered 2.8's is I have been helping a friend with his MFI single turbo.

    He is ready to push it & the fuelling test runs looked promising. MFI is a nightmare to tune!
    I thought everyone was still around the 300-340bhp mark so I thought he might have something special but I am wrong. lol

    Anyway I think it will interest you as he is running a single GT2860RS.
    This is just fuelling runs at 14psi. Normal fuel.

    Click image for larger version Name:	160408 Dyno Graph 7.JPG Views:	149 Size:	129.9 KB ID:	78275
    Last edited by DAVE323; 17-04-2016 at 23:35.

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    Re: What do the most powerful 2.8 based v6 12v Colognes make in the world?

    Only thing from the original 2.8l efi setup left is the intake manifold, everything else have changed and Haltech Sport 2000 is controlling fuel and ignition.

    Ok, I think myself that these are rather small turbo's, but it really depends what you aim for and play around normally Ok, that's intresting dyno sheet, which turbine housing he has? .86 or the smaller .64?

    Haven't had any problems yet with the joined exhaust ports in the head, cooling is controlled via bmw electric water pump without any thermostat (water pump controller controlls the temp). I have small holes drilled in the heads between the joined ports to allow little bit more water flow at that point, or where those there already. Don't actually remember for sure..

    This kind of sounds like a bigger engine now, video clip with only downpipes attached (yeah, the started does keep very bad sound, need to find smaller starter to get it closer the flywheel) -> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ndZL4v5Va0M

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    Re: What do the most powerful 2.8 based v6 12v Colognes make in the world?

    Hi again The single turbo GT2860RS is rather special. The guy wanted something that would just bolt in to replace the T3 the car had already fitted.
    He also wanted it to spool the same as the T3 but make more power.
    So I told him to import a GT2860RS from the States that had a T3 5 Bolt Turbine fitted with an AR of 0.48

    The drilled holes is an upgrade that 2.8 tuners have been doing for as long as I remember.
    I think due to the E85 fuel & large turbos your using it has helped greatly to reduce heat at the joined ports.
    It was a major problem for me.

    I like it, sounds nice.

    Here is more work that you should find interesting.

    This is a 2.9 based engine but it used 2 x GT2860RS turbos with 0.64 AR The owner was disappointed with low down power compared to his previous install, his engine simply couldn't drive the GT28's till 4000rpm. In the end they used a 50 shot of nitrous that did improve things but still the engine was very flat below 4000rpm.

    Click image for larger version Name:	Dyno New 1.jpg Views:	129 Size:	118.8 KB ID:	78306

    Click image for larger version Name:	Dyno New 2.jpg Views:	129 Size:	130.0 KB ID:	78307

    You should have better results as your higher compression & E85 fuel so you can drive the turbos from lower rpm.

    This is one of my engines.
    I recommend 2x GT2056, GT2252 or GT2554.

    All work well on a low compression 2.9 on normal fuel & make 500bhp max.

    Click image for larger version Name:	Dyno GT2252.jpg Views:	128 Size:	127.4 KB ID:	78308
    Last edited by DAVE323; 19-04-2016 at 10:07.

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    Re: What do the most powerful 2.8 based v6 12v Colognes make in the world?

    Well things have moved on & we got there in the end.

    My friend Mick now owns the most powerful 2.8 Cologne in the U.K.
    It runs on normal U.K pump fuel so possibly the most powerful in the world on that fuel.
    Anyway he is very pleased especially after a few people have said his results where not even possible.


    MFI fuelling was a huge expense & a complete waste of time.
    Just so hard to tune it & it was literally holding the engine back.
    Once he moved on to EFI & Emerald management things became far easier & the results where then easy to be honest.

    So here is the result.

    at 19 psi boost 358.1 BHP and - 365 ft.lbs torque.

    Attachment 80746

    This is the finished engine spec.

    The turbo will now have to be changed if Mick wants more.
    Engine still has more in it but the turbo is maxed out.

    Engine core block - standard 2.8i Cologne V6 re-bored 1.5 mm
    Fitted 2.9 Cologne V6 Crankshaft. - total capacity after grind and bore 3068cc (3.1)
    Accralite Turbo pistons - machined for long stroke crank use
    Heavy duty main and big end bearings and bolts
    Hi-pressure I hi-volume Melling oil pump
    AP Racing paddle clutch
    30% lightened flywheel
    Full bottom end reciprocating component set - fully lightened and balanced
    Fast Road Camshaft / followers and springs - Full Kent V6T21 kit
    Aluminium cam timing gear set
    Cylinder heads - fully reworked to stage 3 Turbo spec. Stainless steel valves,
    Including larger exhaust valves. Unleaded fuel valve seats fitted.
    Reworked water passage ways, especially around exhaust port areas.
    Felpro Gaskets throughout
    Garrett GT2860RS turbo unit with external actuator - boost set at 9, 6 or 19 psi - switchable
    Large intercooler
    Coil pack ignition
    EFI injection system from late 2.8i Granada fitted
    440 Injectors fitted
    Emerald programmable ECU system fitted to control fuelling
    3 maps installed for the 3 boost levels
    3 bar MAP sensor fitted
    Baffled sump pan
    302/28mm vented grooved Hi-Spec brake discs fitted with Hi-Spec Monster-4 calipers and
    Greenstuff pads.
    MT75 4x4 gearbox fitted and prop
    Dynamo setup and tested - at 19 psi boost 358.1 BHP and - 365 ft.lbs torque. (494Nm)
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails 170103 Dyno Graph EFI 19 PSI 02.jpg‎  

    Last edited by DAVE323; 24-04-2017 at 11:59.

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