Historic Touring Racing Mk2 Escort

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  • wxneypar
    Bodger
    • Mar 2011
    • 110

    Historic Touring Racing Mk2 Escort

    Hi everyone, we talked about it in the power plots section, but I want to have a thread here so we can talk a little about everything

    This is my race car:
    The car is a 1978 1600 Sport Escort, used just for racing in the National Historic Touring Car championship currently.
    It's within FIA security regulations and the championship regulations which are a lot, but to sum up, power to weight ratio limited at 7.5kg per HP (eg: a 750kg car can't have more than 100HP)



    The engine:
    - 1600 Xflow
    - 10.5:1 CR
    - Pistons are VW 1.8 8v ones (It's hard to get good original pistons here in Uruguay so this is a common mod here. Photo attached)
    - Lightened flywheel
    - 42mm/34mm valves on a nicely ported head
    - Iskenderian cam (.387 valve lift, 290deg advertised duration on a 108 lobe center, .024" valve lash for int and exh. 3500-7500 RPM band)
    - Custom made Electronic ignition distributor
    - 40DCOE32 Carbs on 55 idles, 30 pumps, 135 mains, 180 air correctors and F11 emulsion tubes.





    Hope you enjoy the post. Any ideas or suggestions for the car or engine are always welcome.
    Thanks!
  • wxneypar
    Bodger
    • Mar 2011
    • 110

    #2
    Re: Historic Touring Racing Mk2 Escort

    So to begin with the discussion, I'm in the process of making some coilovers for the front suspension. Currently is on custom spring on original struts.
    I need to get the Springs from the UK, so I was wondering if you have any suggestions on brands, rate and length for a circuit car.
    I was thinking around 500 lb, and I'm not sure how to calculate the length I need.
    I saw Burton has a lot of options, are those good quality?

    Thanks!
    Peter

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    • Graham
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      • Feb 2006
      • 25168

      #3
      Re: Historic Touring Racing Mk2 Escort

      what sort of tyres do you use? normal road tyres, sticky track tyres like toyo 888, yoko 008r, or slicks. there are race escorts using 500lb front springs, but that is very stiff for an x/flow powered escort
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      • wxneypar
        Bodger
        • Mar 2011
        • 110

        #4
        Re: Historic Touring Racing Mk2 Escort

        We all have to use the same tyres as part of the championship rules. Those are Jinyu YH11 185 60 13 road tyres.
        The 500lbs was just a guess, do you think it is too much? What do you suggest?
        I have custom made springs now which are way stiffer than standard but don't really know how much. It certainly corners better than standard rate obviously.

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        • Graham
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          • Feb 2006
          • 25168

          #5
          Re: Historic Touring Racing Mk2 Escort

          with springs the more grip you generate the more body roll you get the stiffer the spring can go.

          your tyres are regular road tyres and fairly narrow at that so 500lb will be far too stiff, so maybe 250lb even that may be a bit too stiff, most fast road x/flow powered escorts used 145-175lb

          you can get race spring from many sources, the length you need will be dictated by your struts and ride height, about 10 inch long will probably work, you could try measuring to see what you need by putting the front suspension together WITHOUT any springs and jacking the body to the correct ride height and measuring from spring platform to top mount

          Browse and buy from our range of Suspension and Steering online and instore at Demon Tweeks. We are the UK’s leading Motorsport retailer with over 50 years of experience. Finance and next day delivery is available online, at the best prices available. Shop all of our Motorsport ranges today.
          Last edited by Graham; 13-09-2018, 18:52.
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          • wxneypar
            Bodger
            • Mar 2011
            • 110

            #6
            Re: Historic Touring Racing Mk2 Escort

            That's a great method to measure length, thanks.
            Let's say I use your method and measure 10 inches, I buy 10 inches springs, but when fitted and the car is not on the jack, the ride height would go lower as the engine weight is over them.
            Do you know (aproximately of course) how much would the springs collapse once the car is on the floor?

            2nd question: Burton springs are £21.12, Faulkners are 26 an eibachs are 75. Are those THAT better? I can pay the difference if it is worthy, but want to know if it is.

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            • Graham
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              • Feb 2006
              • 25168

              #7
              Re: Historic Touring Racing Mk2 Escort

              burton springs could be anything, nothing wrong with faulkners id buy them ( i have many times)

              with a 250lb spring the suspension wont drop much with the weight of the car on it inch maybe two, so if you measure with the coilover collar in the middle of the height adjustment you should be able to get it where you want it
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              • wxneypar
                Bodger
                • Mar 2011
                • 110

                #8
                Re: Historic Touring Racing Mk2 Escort

                Originally posted by Graham
                burton springs could be anything, nothing wrong with faulkners id buy them ( i have many times)

                with a 250lb spring the suspension wont drop much with the weight of the car on it inch maybe two, so if you measure with the coilover collar in the middle of the height adjustment you should be able to get it where you want it
                That is great information! Thank you.
                I already ordered the Adjustable spring seat kit, I'll start the measurements when I get it fitted then.
                Have a good day
                Peter

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                • wxneypar
                  Bodger
                  • Mar 2011
                  • 110

                  #9
                  Re: Historic Touring Racing Mk2 Escort

                  Some photos of the last race 2 weeks ago:
                  The water pump belt failed (or decided to get off the engine) and I had to retire.



                  This is the latest power plot before the race. Blue lines are the newest, the yellow one was the one from the previous race.



                  I still have to carry a lot of weight because of the power (Remember the regulation of 7.5 kg per HP)
                  If I can flatten the power curve at the top where it gets to around 125 I can unload 75kg, which is would be great cause it is really affecting the car's cornering and braking behavior.
                  I'm thinking about limiting the current advance curve, do you think it is possible to achieve it like that?
                  I really don't have much time to work on any other heavy change in the engine between races.

                  Thanks!
                  Peter

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                  • wxneypar
                    Bodger
                    • Mar 2011
                    • 110

                    #10
                    Re: Historic Touring Racing Mk2 Escort

                    Hi everyone! Happy New year!

                    After that race where the water pump belt decided to go away I dismantled the engine to check, everything was OK except for valve seats so I had them done again and just put all together again.

                    The result: 10 hp less. And stops pulling around 1000RPM earlier
                    Tried jetting and ignition advance up and down with no luck.

                    Three months later, with the season ended I still can't find the reason.
                    The engine runs great except for a really sublte rattling at 6k.
                    Just removed the carbs and found one of the rear inspection covers is not there anymore. Could this be the reason? I find it very hard to believe.

                    Any wild guesses I can try?
                    Thanks in advance,

                    Peter

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                    • Graham
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                      • Feb 2006
                      • 25168

                      #11
                      Re: Historic Touring Racing Mk2 Escort

                      maybe your valve springs were marginal and if you recut the seats the valves would of sat a bit deeper in the head which would give even less valve spring pressure, enough just to tip it into valve bounce at high rpm
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                      • wxneypar
                        Bodger
                        • Mar 2011
                        • 110

                        #12
                        Re: Historic Touring Racing Mk2 Escort

                        Well it is a possibility, and it is easy to check, I just have to measure the springs at their compressed state, I think the installed height should be 34mm.
                        But the power band has almost 10hp less pretty much everywhere, that shouldn't be the result if that was the issue, right?
                        I mean, I find it hard to believe that the power lost is not related to having dismantled the engine, but maybe it is something else and was just a coincidence.
                        Either way I want to find the issue before the season starts again, so welcome to ideas.

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                        • runner
                          Tyre Kicker
                          • Dec 2013
                          • 19

                          #13
                          Re: Historic Touring Racing Mk2 Escort

                          nice car

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                          • wxneypar
                            Bodger
                            • Mar 2011
                            • 110

                            #14
                            Re: Historic Touring Racing Mk2 Escort

                            Thanks runner!!
                            Hi everyone! Hope you are enjoying your summer.

                            I have a quick question:
                            The regulations for the series I race in, allow the car have the front track width increased to a maximum of 5% more than the original one.
                            That being said, there are a lot of variants for the "original track with" as you may know that the different models with different rims have different track width.

                            I want to find the larger one so I can get the most of it, it can be in any kind of workshop manual or homologation scan.
                            I have searched https://historicdb.fia.com/cars/list

                            The biggest one I found there was 1295,4mm
                            Any ideas on where to find more data on this? (and hopefully a bigger number )

                            Thanks!

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                            • piekey
                              Spanner Monkey
                              • Feb 2012
                              • 483

                              #15
                              Re: Historic Touring Racing Mk2 Escort

                              We ran a nice MK1 escort mexico in Shell Super riad saloons many years back. Running a 1600 x flow on yokohama 008 then when Toyo sponsored the series, we ran road spec Toyo.
                              Suspension had to be original pick up points etc.
                              We ran Twin cam front anti roll bar & 350 lb front springs. Also tweaked the 3 inner wing holes to gain camber ( no adj tca,s available back then)
                              We won a fair amount of races , along with the BARC home counties championship 3 times.
                              We must have put the car together about right.

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