Cheap zetec conversion

[dale1219]

Hi all im new. Glad I stumbled upon this great site. I currently own a lowly 1600 mk2 ghia. Its a 4 door but I cant justify paying 2dr prices!

I want to bring it into the modern world, and i dont have much spare cash.

I was wondering how I can get a zetec into my escort for as cheap as possiable. Im not bothered about power figures or other performance factors so whats the cheapest way? This is what ive come up with so far, maybe you guys can answer a few questions for me to.

Sump: Modifyed 1800 CVH with big wings using the 1800 pickup pipe.
Engine mounts: My own - I can weld.
Water rail: Raceline
Flywheel: Retroford exchange
Starter motor: DOHC

Now what i want to know is about fueling and ignition. Most people would say bin the induction system, its crap,, and I can gain 20bhp+ if I used after market throttle bodies and ECU. However Im not too bothered about power figures, I just want economy and reliabilty. Can I use the standard induction and ECU? and if so would it have to be from an early car that does have an imobiliser.

Im guessing the 1.8 would be the easiest engine to convert, but I think all the 2.0l needs is the water pump from an 1800 and the inlet manifold gasket

Also I have heard no mention of manifolds on here. Is it a custom made job or will one from a CVH fit?

Thanks - dale

[markb]

you can get an exhausr manifold from Ashley.. not too expensive iirc.
I think the retroford water rail is cheaper than the raceline one but I'm not 100% on that one.
Not sure if you could use the standard induction etc.. i think you may run into problems with the ecu due to the fact that it controls a hell of a lot more than just the engine iirc... might be cheaper to go for megajolt ot something similar with carbs if you're really on a tight budget?

[dale1219]

Using carbs defeats the point to be honest.. I thought the retro ford wanted £185 for their water rail.

[dale1219]

This is where I got the prices from:

http://www.105speed.com/default.asp?id=206

Its a little bit cheeky selling the water pump and assembly for £55, when you can get the 1800 one that rotates the correct way from a motor factors for £20.

I bet they are the same thing!

[markb]

Fair enough...

sorry re the pricing .. for some reason i thought the retroford one was cheaper.

[RChambers]

It is cheaper. The raceline price doesn't include VAT so its nearly £220 all up. It does look a lot nicer though.

Richard

[markb]

Thanking you Mr Richard

[TepiTheFinn]

Flywheel: Retroford exchange

What is it and why?

[dale1219]

Tepi, because it says so here http://www.zetecescorts.bravehost.com/gearbox.html

Im not too clued up on clutches

[Clint]

Why not use the standard Zetec water outlet if you are doing it on the cheap, means modding the bulkhead though.

[Zetec_Escorts]

Retroford will re-drill you flywheel to take the cheaper pinto clutch for £40. As the pinto clutch is designed for cable it also lighter than any zetec hybrid clutch.

[dale1219]

Thanks for the replys lads. How much of the bulkhead needs to be cut back? Is it just the lip or does the heater bubble have to be removed/modded?

[markb]

I guess if you can weld yourself (in) then that's on the cheap... modding the bulkhead is generally a rasonable (but worth it IMO) expense

[Retromotorsport]

Clint said:
Why not use the standard Zetec water outlet if you are doing it on the cheap, means modding the bulkhead though.

And a bitch to change the stat............

[Lee S]

dale it can be done, I know of a guy who put a 2.0 litre zetec in his mk3 cortina using the standard ECU. I think your problem will be getting the standard inlet manifold to fit in the escort bay

[Dave]

If you want reliability and economy the crossflow you already have will take some beating. If you want to improve performance a bit, a cheap pinto will do that.
Nothing wrong with wanting to put a zetec in, I quite fancy the idea myself. But I still think that for less money you could improve the crossflow you already have. As far as economy goes, improving your crossflow would be cheaper than insuring something converted to 2 litre zetec.
Just an alternative view, not trying to put you off.

[dale1219]

I really have my heart set on efi. I want it to start everytime and not have to look under the bonnet and adjust points and fiddle with carbs! I wouldnt say the xflow is good on juice, everytime I start it up it gulps loads of petrol on the auto choke. Even the 1.6 zetec would do.

Does anyone have a picture or can tell me what needs doing to the bulkhead if I dont use a water rail?.

[Retromotorsport]

You will need to cut the bulkhead back, not as much as that but its gonna be a cut

[dale1219]

Your joking!

So none has got ny picture of the conversion without using the water rail?

I think i will just use the water rail, if its too much. I thought you just had to cut the lip back on the bulkhead.

[RChambers]

If you want to do it really cheap I believe you can blank off the off thermostat housing and drill and tap the pinto one onto the side. I have heard of this being done but never seen it. Anyone got a scrap zetec head to try it out on? If you look at the zetec engine with the standard stat then its a bloody annoying square box that sticks out in just the wrong place. You would have to cut out a section of bulkhead to clear this and box it back in with new metal. Like Gary said though, its gonna be a pain in the ass to change the thermostat!

Richard

[dale1219]

How often do you change the thermostat though?

The blanking plate sound like an idea. I guess it would look un-proffesional having a long top hose running the length of the block though. I dont mind paying for the waterrail its just the ECU and TB that bumps up the price.

[dangerousdave]

It would look professional if you had just the necessary bits of hose to join it to the rad and thermostat housing with a length of stainless tube for the bit inbetween, then it would look similar to the retro ford one with a long tube runing down the side of the block??

Why not ditch the auto choke on the xflow then it wont gulp as much fuel as you say, and also the electronic ignition from the fiesta works well (no more points)

[Clint]

retromotorsport said:

Clint said:
Why not use the standard Zetec water outlet if you are doing it on the cheap, means modding the bulkhead though.

And a bitch to change the stat............

Gary luckily I have never personally owned a car that had a stat failure, are the Zetec ones unreliable ?

[Retromotorsport]

.. But if you do have to change one.. i would rather undo a couple of bolts than remove the engine, also on a lot of cars the area that needs moving back has been eaten by tin worm, so it requires work anyway. If it needs new metal, put it in further back

[Clint]

retromotorsport said:
.. But if you do have to change one.. i would rather undo a couple of bolts than remove the engine, also on a lot of cars the area that needs moving back has been eaten by tin worm, so it requires work anyway. If it needs new metal, put it in further back

I fully agree and if i was to do one I would mess about as you know I would simply point at the engine then point at the car while grunting and looking at you LMAO

However he asked for cheap, and the cheapest way may not be the most practicle and well thought out

[FF_Mark]

You grunt while looking at Gary oo-eer

[Retromotorsport]

A Classic case of thinking forward is when you have a hooooge and rare gearbox that should be able to take loads of grunt and be well reliable, the customer thinks ' what if ' and has the ability built into the car to take a more easily avalible and common gearbox while the parts are arriving to repair the exotic one.

The case with the thermostat... if, as sods law goes you drive from lands end to john o'groats and the stat sticks closed, engine temp is climbing.... answer .. take the stat out.. Which method of instalation is the best?

I hate working in and around engines, gearboxes etc.. some of the things that get in the way, some of the bits from other areas that have to be removed to make way to get the one part out that you want to change.. How many Mondeo owners put the wishbone bolt back in the same way as Ford did once they have cut the old one out? Everyone who has a large gearbox tunnel in their car says how great it is to do a clutch change... changing from points to electronic... the points work don't they?

If a customer chose the Retroford stat housing and they had a little rot in the belt rail, I would try my hardest to persuade them that a little cut back is the best option, the rots gone, the engine can tilt back so helping on clutch changes, and the stat, if it did go tits up can be changed without dropping the box down and the engine mounts off to allow the engine and box to move forward enough.
If the shell was mint, then leave alone, but very few are nowadays

But then again, perhaps I'm missing the point of tinkering with old cars..

[dale1219]

How much needs to be taken out of the bulkhead? Can the heater matrix still be retained?

Does anyone have a picture? Somone must of done an early conversion without the water dunnell/raceline water rail!

dale

[Lee S]

£350 zetec conversions. Looks bloody good doesnt it?





Parts and costs
2.0l Zetec £50 for a L reg. Mondeo.
Engine oil £6
Various gaskets £20
Stainless steel £75
Stainless welding wire £11
Radiator hoses £15
Throttle cable £17
Drill bits, taps and hole cutter £30
Jubilee clips £5
Pinto release bearing £11
Pinto spigot bearing £7
Mondeo clutch drive plate £20
1.8 CVH Sierra sump, pick up pipe and sandwich plate £20
Escort water pump £35
Cam belt £5
Alternator drive belt £2
Alloy for fan adapter £5
Fuel filter £2
Fuel pump £15
Fuel lines £5
Total £356 (although I already had most of these parts lying around so layout was less).

[Ian0x]

What car is that lump sitting in popee? doesnt look like an escort to me

[markb]

just what i was thinking.

[Lee S]

Its in a mk3 cortina.

He said you might have issues getting the inlet manifold to fit in an escort as the engine bay is amaller, but if you look at the actual 'hole' that the engine sits in, it doesnt look any bigger than a scorts, and the inlet doesnt look that big from where im looking.

He is gonna email me the dimensions of the engine etc tonight so I can size up weather the inlet manifold with fit

Anyone else intrested now it CAN be done for cheap and well.

[markb]

The actual hole looks smaller as well to me.. although i realise it's unlikely.

[RChambers]

The standard inlet manifold/plenum will hit the inner wing on a mk1/2 Escort. Thats why companies like phoenix made modified plenums.

Some of those prices are in dream world btw. How the hell can you run fuel injections lines down a car for that money??? Its costing me over £100 just for fuel lines

Richard

[TepiTheFinn]

RChambers said:
The standard inlet manifold/plenum will hit the inner wing on a mk1/2 Escort.

blactop manifold will clear innerwing, but engine x-member and engine mount are on the way. also bulkhead side is tight

[Lee S]

RChambers said:
The standard inlet manifold/plenum will hit the inner wing on a mk1/2 Escort. Thats why companies like phoenix made modified plenums.

Some of those prices are in dream world btw. How the hell can you run fuel injections lines down a car for that money??? Its costing me over £100 just for fuel lines

Richard

Use a low pressure fuel line until u get to the engine bay, then have your high pressure fuel pump mounted in the engine bay. It cuts down out the amount of high pressure line u need to use.

Also it would cost much less for second hand stuff!

[ludsonline]

Got any more details? What wiring loom ignition/ecu used?

[Clint]

Use Plastic Fuel Line, its about a £1 a meter

[markb]

RChambers said:
Its costing me over £100 just for fuel lines

was gonna say... if you don't use the blingy fuel line then surely it doesn't have to be that expensive?

[Clint]

Oh nad cut the mounts off the cross member and chassis mount it, cost £25 DIY