Moggy's Darrian T9

[genRS2000]

Re: Moggy's Darrian T9

Moggy, can you tell me what Wilwoods you have? I have just bought Powerlites for the rear of my Escort so I hope they will be OK as they are the newer design. Got APs on the front and they are brilliant. The only reason I got the powerlites is that have a mechanical handbrake built in.

[Moggy]

Re: Moggy's Darrian T9

I think these are Dynolyte. I also have to have a mechanical handrbake for Rallies...we cobbled it up with cables and modified pads.

It works very well and it even genuine passed the MOT.

[Moggy]

Re: Moggy's Darrian T9

Right we rallied the car yesterday. We took it to an event at a place called 3 Sisters. It's a small little venue designed as a cart track I think. Anyway it's quite nice to test a car.

Unfortunately there had been a nightime enduro cart meeting there on the saturday night, then it rained frequently and heavily on and off during the day so it was like driving on ice. Even when it dried out a bit we got caught on one stage sitting on the start line on slicks just as the heavens opened again......it was sliding and aquaplaning arround.

Anyway we had fun and learned a few things about the car.

To start with we had no grip at all, front or rear and heavily locking front brakes (the problem we have had all along)

We gradually improved the front end grip during the day by progresive softening of the dampers and reducing the tyre pressure (we had Dunlop X22's in wet and slick depending on the surface).

The rear end we seriously struggled with.....we did get a small improvement by reducing the roll bar stiffness, but it was still a real animal, wanting to go sideways everywhere especially under power which was a real problem trying to get back on the gass out of corners as the car would sharply break away and not let you put the power down....imagine trying to drive a powerful escort on an icy road quickly and that was the effect......we were having to really carefully feed in the power, slowly and gently, which is exactly what you don't want in a tarmac rally car. To give an idea of how bad it was...we spun on the first stage on the straight when changing up a gear...it was so slippery it just lit up the back tyres and round it went....no amount of lock was going to stop it. (very embarrassing)

The brakes we improved a bit, especially as we found more front end grip, but we ended up right at the end of the balance bar and were still with too much front bias. Really we now need to start changing cylinders....currently it is 0.625 front and 0.7 rear..........I think I will try 0.7 all round as a first step.

Anyway we got round and the car, whilst still a long way off, is a lot better than it was at the start of the day.

Photos to follow.

[Retromotorsport]

Re: Moggy's Darrian T9

Sounds fun!!!

Brake pedal, how much movement do you have? tiny ammount or a good inch or so?

[Moggy]

Re: Moggy's Darrian T9

there's about an inch.

[Retromotorsport]

Re: Moggy's Darrian T9

going up on the front cylinder size will give less travel, which means your trying to modulate your braking over a shorter distance of pedal travel, imagine trying to stop a stopwatch between 10 and 11 seconds, and between 10 and 15 seconds, the longer time gap means you have more chance of stopping between the marks.

Its a hard one to sort this, as your rear engined, but i would say having a play with the cylinders is the right way, and do this while the bias is set in the middle, so when its sorted you have travel both ways.

And don't forget, you can always experiment with a little air in the system, a bit in the locking end, can take a bit of bite away which can point you in the right direction.
Good luck

[Moggy]

Re: Moggy's Darrian T9

Photo from 3 sisters last week


Since the rally we have traced the massive rear end grip problems to a number of issues which we are in the middle of sorting prior to the car's next out on Anglesey on the 7th and 8th November.

- slight rear toe in.
- slight rear static negative camber. (you can see on the photo above the rear tyre is tucking in...even in the wet!)
- significant adjustment (softening) of the rear blade roll bar.

We are making a number of other changes prior to Anglesey....at the moment the car is a complete animal to drive, but with plenty of sorting you can see it will be quick.

[MCURZON]

Re: Moggy's Darrian T9

Car is looking fantastic!! Low and mean. I see the T9 my mum used to navigate in is for sale on fast road and track for £14,500, so cheap i'm very tempted!!

[Moggy]

Re: Moggy's Darrian T9

Car is looking fantastic!! Low and mean. I see the T9 my mum used to navigate in is for sale on fast road and track for £14,500, so cheap i'm very tempted!!

Cheers!

Yes that's a lot of car for the money! Only thing is it's transverse with a spaceframe rear end...........would it need to be re-logbooked when the 2012 regs come in?

[MCURZON]

Re: Moggy's Darrian T9

Cheers!

Yes that's a lot of car for the money! Only thing is it's transverse with a spaceframe rear end...........would it need to be re-logbooked when the 2012 regs come in?

Not sure, would explain why cheap though.

[Moggy]

Re: Moggy's Darrian T9

right..........we are still really struggling with our brakes. Since the rally we increased the front cylinder size to a 0.7 (from 0.625)............so we now have 0.7 all round.

we tried the car again, but it still has far too much to the front and locks up very easily, even with the balance bar set to the rear.

What we did find though is that if I drive the car and then sort of 1/4 apply the hydraulic hand brake whilst then also applying the footbrake the brakes work well.....you can really then feel the brakes working all round and the car stops powerfully and more evenly.

So we are thinking we have to get more rear brake effort to balance the front.....we are going to go down a size with the rear cylinder which should create more rear brake line pressure.

If that doesn't work then we will attach an anchor to the back of the car which the co driver will chuck out the window every time the front locks.

[Retromotorsport]

Re: Moggy's Darrian T9

Pulling the handbrake up, brings the pads closer to the disc, then apply the foot brake ... and you have brakes.. sounds like your still not flowing enough fluid to the rear or your getting massive pad knock back

[Roadsport]

Re: Moggy's Darrian T9

Pulling the handbrake up, brings the pads closer to the disc, then apply the foot brake ... and you have brakes.. sounds like your still not flowing enough fluid to the rear or your getting massive pad knock back

I was about to suggest the exact same thing.
Had that problem with the englis rear axle. Had to pull from the handbrake to get the pads near the disc. As it told in the escort topic of yours.

I take it your rear discs and wheel bearings are ok? Either of them wobling around would kick the pads back.
I have installed a springs behind my front caliper pistons to keep them near the discs. Could this help with your rear brakes.

[Moggy]

Re: Moggy's Darrian T9

I was about to suggest the exact same thing.
Had that problem with the englis rear axle. Had to pull from the handbrake to get the pads near the disc. As it told in the escort topic of yours.

I take it your rear discs and wheel bearings are ok? Either of them wobling around would kick the pads back.
I have installed a springs behind my front caliper pistons to keep them near the discs. Could this help with your rear brakes.

Thanks for the advice chaps.....but I don't think it is pad knock off. If it was then applying the brakes and then imediately appying them again would make the rears work....it doesn't help at all.....

I need to get this sorted very quickly now....the car has another event next week, a two day one with night stages....it will be a much faster event than the last one so I could really do with decent brakes.

[Retromotorsport]

Re: Moggy's Darrian T9

Ok..

1,quick possible fix, get an inline residual presure valve, plumb it in and see what happens, fit it right my the master cylinder..
2, disconnect the hyd Handbrake ... try it, if this works you'll have to engineer twin calipers at the rear.

http://www.rallydesign.co.uk/product_info.php?products_id=4081